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Around SBN: Win or Lose, Boston Celtics' New Big 3 Era A Success

2012: Rebuilding With an Open Window


Okay, new year, new team! Craziness, huh? Is the Turner Era over? Smith? What comes next. Two of our three killer elements (OL, pass rush) need sudden rebuilding, while a third one (QB) is in his peak and we don't want to squander him. So what to do this year? What to do with our coaching and management situation? What players do we need to replace? How can we replace them? What will our team look like afterward?

Management: I understand those who say that AJ must go. He did a great job for the first three years. The 2003 UDFA class was legendary. But since then, he's really struggled. This year was a bit better, and I wouldn't be surprised if he's getting a handle and coming into a better cycle. If we'd made the playoffs, then we could overlook the mistakes. But now, we really have to replace him, and replace him with somebody we know understands the team and knows how to evaluate talent. This is difficult to do, and you can wreck your team by jumping too fast. I think the best plan is to make it crystal clear that he's on notice, by interviewing GM/HC combos, and if you can find a guy that you know you can go forward with, doing it. No silly ventures. If nobody grabs you as having the smarts and understanding to get the job done, give AJ the Marty '06 deal: one year, get into the championship round or find a new gig.

Star-divide

Coaching: Bye-bye Manusky. Norv, well it depends on what happens with the GM search. If they think they lucked out on a GM/HC type, a new Belichick or Shanahan, and if he's a defensive type (unlike Belichick or Shanahan), there may still be a place for Norv in the organization. If they replace AJ, the new GM may or may not keep Norv, and either decision is okay by me. Probably not.... Somehow I doubt Norv would take a demotion, but if he would, he can run the offense as long as he wants. But as a Head Coach, he's just not going to get us there.

Offense: We have Gaither! Somehow I knew we would end up with him, but it's just fantastic that we got him in the way that we did. We've got the ground game, will be able to keep the receiving squad intact (Jackson's mediocre season was good for us), got the starter QB... and then it's a jungle. If McNeill can play on, I hope they trade him for a 2013 first-round pick, or a high 2012 2nd. He's pretty good, but he's no Gaither. A new GM may not be a big fan of Clary, but he's here one more year for sure, just because of all the problems on the line. We want to draft a RT prospect highly anyway: a bookend pair of maulers would take a lot of pressure off our interior OL, which may be in for a decline, and if we can draft a big mean kid who can play LG for a year, that's even better. Vasquez is fine, but we need to draft a LG and a C, and hopefully can keep Hardwick one more year to help our new C develop on the bench; if not, does Mooch have another year, or do we need a FA? We need depth at QB and TE. There will be journeyman QBs to be had, and we can draft a TE in the 4th or 5th.

Defense: We're deep on the line, but we're at half-staff everywhere else. We need a difference-making pass rusher. You can only draft those guys, you can't count on them, and they're injury-prone. This year, a second or third round pick and another, later draft pick is about all we can manage. We may be in for an upgrade in the pass rush, we may not. Our ILB squad should be okay: maybe another body, but no draft picks unless it's a BPA in the 6th or 7th. We've got one good safety, and lots of depth at SS and nickel. Our corners are limited but not terrible, which makes them sort of a Rorschach test: either you see them playing too far off because the QB has too much time, or you see limited players who have to give up too much cushion. But if you want to do better, only a first-round pick even gives you a crapshoot.

Special Teams: We should make Kaeding fight to beat Novak out. He will, but maybe Scifres can take on kickoff duties? I knew Goodman would be a great KR: if they can incorporate him into the offense, he could be pretty dangerous.

Best case scenario: Hardwick stays on another year, we get a good player or pick for McNeill, and end up filling holes at ROLB and LG, as well as finding a RT and C of the future (one of whom possibly could be the LG of the present, esp if we can do the C transition over two years). A first-rounder on a great ROLB prospect is not all that likely, but a good hit there would solve a lot of the team's problems. If the BPA in the first or second round is a CB, that's not a bad pick. Truth be told, a new DC and a couple new bodies, and the defense could look like a different animal. This could be doubly true if Liuget gets on top of the learning curve next year: Liuget, Castillo, and Martin combine for a great rotation.

Likely scenario: Our OL going into next year is kind of patchwork, with a combination of promising players and experienced players, with Gaither and Vasquez being the only ones who fit in both categories. If we have a rookie Center, we'll be in trouble, but I doubt that will happen. Our pass-rush will be a little better just by regression to the mean, but the offense will have to carry the day. Remember Air Coryell? Of course you do: we've been living it intermittently since 2008.

What do you all think?

This FanPost was written by a member of the Bolts From The Blue community and does not necessarily reflect the views of the Bolts From The Blue editors or SB Nation.

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You probably wrote this as soon as they announced that the Chargers will be keeping both Norv and AJ, so that takes care of the management and coaching scenarios. I honestly think they will give Manusky another year.

The fans are going to be so loud they are going to hear us in the next Dimension - abayarde

by BillsFanSanDiego619 on Jan 3, 2012 12:32 PM PST reply actions  

Yeah, I posted this about five minutes before the announcement.

Durn it! I blame Nuffle.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 4, 2012 7:47 PM PST up reply actions  

Rookie Centers

I think you can do quite well with a rookie center if you get the right one.

anyone trying to contact me via my yahoo account should be aware it has been hacked

by Cold_Old_Steelers_Fan on Jan 3, 2012 2:04 PM PST reply actions  

...says the guy whose team picked up Pouncey

This is true, but I think it’s a pretty rare scenario. In fact, Pouncey is the only one I can think of who’s been able to start so early in his career.

Yakety Sax: Making divisional matchups hilarious since 1963.
Gaslamp Ball: SMELLS LIKE PROSPECTS IN HERE

Please, call me StrangeBro.

by StrangeBroP25 on Jan 3, 2012 5:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Nick Hardwick did just fine starting as a rookie.

Bolts from the Blue // "At least when Wade is spewing vitriol he does so with an intellectual flair." - insanebolt21
Bloody Elbow // "I think we're poking fun at Leland's 'boner.'" - Michael Fagan

by Richard Wade on Jan 3, 2012 8:11 PM PST up reply actions  

Pounceys Plural I think you mean

but I know what you are saying.

anyone trying to contact me via my yahoo account should be aware it has been hacked

by Cold_Old_Steelers_Fan on Jan 4, 2012 3:10 PM PST up reply actions  

1st Round Pick ='s

a STARTER their ROOKIE YEAR. And actually with this team there isn’t a reason why the 1st 3 rounds couldn’t result in 3 new starters. Anything else has to be considered a failure. In my opinion we should be looking at 4.5 starters from this years rookie draft (the .5 being a player who may not start but gets plenty of time on the field). And one more thing AJ! Stop being a penis and do your job in the FA market this year!

by MacDeezul on Jan 3, 2012 4:09 PM PST reply actions  

He did his job in FA last year!

Spikes, Sanders, Gaither… what do you want?

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 4, 2012 7:48 PM PST up reply actions  

Really?

Spikes – Great career, past his prime – probably wouldn’t start for 20 other NFL teams (that’s why we were able to get him).

Sanders – An accident waiting to happen. Yeah I was cautiously optimistic for that pick up but how many games did he play for us this season?

Gaither – Was only sought out AFTER we lost our LT, his backup, and his backup’s backup. Has filled in great and might just be our answer at LT. So yeah that was a commendable move. However it wasn’t a move he would have made had our circumstances not warranted it.

I’m talking Free Agency in the Off Season when there are players out there ready to move and get into camps (organized by the NFL, A Team, or by the Players themselves) so they can prepare for the upcoming season.

by MacDeezul on Jan 5, 2012 5:33 AM PST up reply actions  

Spikes had a pretty good year.

Smart-guy players like ILBs who go into their careers with superior physical skills don’t decline like players in fast-guy and big-guy positions, or like lesser athletes in roles like theirs. He’s got more time left on his old legs, even still. Sanders may be done… or not. If you just accept what he is, he’s not all that bad. Don’t pay him much, expect great things for a couple games, and smile knowingly when he gets hurt. If you’ve got an average guy behind him (and we’ve got more than enough average safeties), you’ve got the same thing as an average player with upside.

As far as FA in general goes, I’m not sure where I’d have done much different. This year, there was a mad scramble and they plugged all their holes okay. Most years, there are few or no marquee players out there, and the ones there are usually have big baggage (Fat Albert) or are overrated (Jason Taylor). 2010, the team was just fine on both sides of the ball, and were let down by ST. 2009, they lost their starting NT and C in the first game, and they still went 13-3.

Which reminds me, more important (by far) than offseason UFA skills is the in-season UFA skill. The best value FA pickup is the immediate upgrade who doesn’t cost a lot, the guy who fills in your biggest hole and does a good job. Good teams usually have the ability to fill these holes in the offseason without expensive UFAs. The holes pop up in-season, as the vicissitudes of the game take their toll and good players with little backup suffer serious injuries. The teams that fall apart are usually teams who lose these players and can’t replace them. We’ve suffered some of that lately: the ludicrous failure to replace David Binn isn’t really AJ’s fault (except the part about giving Ethan Albright a chance), but if you want to blame him for not being able to make a move to account for Phillips, I understand. That’s a high bar, but yeah, our OLB squad was not looking good last year. I don’t know what else we could have done, though, at least this year.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 7:49 AM PST up reply actions  

Re: Free Agency

The FA period was three weeks long last year. Three weeks. Smith did a fine job, even if the end result was disappointing.

Previous years, he’s pursued a philosophy of being quiet and staying out of the headlines in the offseason. It’s a good instinct, and if his application of it is far from perfect, at least he doesn’t normally waste a ton of money: if he tries a guy who doesn’t work out, he seldom breaks the bank. If he makes a gamble, he’ll make an insurance move (Buster Davis: Legedu Naanee; Anthony Waters: Brandon Siler). If he breaks out the Brinks truck, he’s almost always doing something smart and effective: Weddle, Rivers, Sproles. When he scores a hit (not infrequently), it’s often out of nowhere, like Ian Scott and Antonio Garay. He seems to love undrafted guys, and the farther down the draft you go, the better he gets. This has led us to our current defensive dilemma, but truth be told one good pick and all our defensive problems are solved.

I think one problem AJ has with the public is that AJ 2007-2010 tends to get compared to AJ 2003-2006, and the brilliance of his 2011 is too close to be properly understood. If you compare AJ 2011 to 2010 to 2009, he looks pretty good. If you compare AJ 2003-2011 to the League as a whole or Chargers history in general, he looks even better. If you compare him to post-Ross Beathard and to Butler, he looks great.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 8:28 AM PST up reply actions  

Meh. My criterion for success is:

Three players who become solid full-time starters, including one who does it as a rookie, and one player who becomes an elite player at his position in his first contract, of four players who become solid full-time starters, including one who does it as a rookie or becomes an elite player at his position in his first contract.

For example, 2003 was okay, even though the top of the draft sucked donkey-balls, they picked up some guys who would be seen as big successes even if picked in the top ten.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 4, 2012 8:15 PM PST up reply actions  

3-4 in the draft. Not counting FA and UDFA.

1st rounders should usually be starters right away. Those who aren’t should develop into stars.

2nd and 3rd rounders should mostly turn into good players at low-risk position and occasionally turn into great players at high-risk positions.

If your 7th rounder pans out, that’s great.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 4, 2012 8:18 PM PST up reply actions  

Must haves...............

We need a big upgrade at OLB. English is probably gone and Phillips is 1 year older and was hurt for 5 or 6 games this last season. I looked at the list of FA OLBs for 2012 and it didn’t look great so this will probably have to be addressed in the draft. Hopefully there is a Ryan Kerrigan type DE/OLB available with one of our first 2 picks.

SS – the Bob Sanders experiment did not go well. I’d be all for drafting a top tier SS with one of our first two picks……………………..or we convert Jammer to SS (he def. lost a step this year) and draft a CB in rounds 1 or 2. Another M. Gilchrest type.

OL – We probably lose Dielman or Hardwick. Most likely Dielman. Hopefully Hardwick is back and we can sign another OG or draft an OG with a pick in the 3 to 7 range. T. Greene probably starts at LG. Hopefully we keep Gaither and Mcneill……move Mcneill to RT and it’s an instant upgrade at RT.

We probably need to draft a project QB late as Voleck is fast approaching 40. Maybe a Kirck Cousins (QB MSU) or Case Keenum (QB UH) type later in the draft.

We also need ILB depth. I like Spikes, but he’s really old for a starting ILB and I don’t have a lot of confidence he can stay healthy or that Mouton will be ready to contribute meaningfully next year (everyone thought he was a huge reach in the 2nd round).

Needs to be addressed via Draft or FA as follows:

1) OLB
2) SS (or CB and convert Jammer)
3) OL
4) ILB
5) QB (project to develop as backup or potential replacement in 3 years)

Also…………………I wouldn’t find Manusky being shown the door. I realize it was 1 year and some guys were injured……….but that rush 3 lineman and play a soft zone over the top is just painful to watch. I’m not sure we have the personnel to cover for 5 to 10 seconds down the field and to generate coverage sacks. I’d much rather have seen an aggressive approach trying to manufacture a pass rush than sitting back passively and getting picked apart. Seemed very Ted Cottrellish and he was fired mid season in favor of Ron Rivera.

by J Korber on Jan 4, 2012 5:01 AM PST reply actions  

From the "How to Assemble the Chargers" Fan Post

1st Round: Dre Kirkpatrick
6’3, 192 pounds | Cornerback | Alabama

First word: Kirkpatrick started 12 of Alabama’s 13 games in 2010 at left cornerback. He finished the year with three interceptions, seven pass breakups and 53 tackles. As a freshman in 2009, Kirkpatrick sat and learned behind Javier Arenas and Kareem Jackson. Leading into his junior year, Kirkpatrick has all the tools to be an elite cornerback. He’s still a work in progress, however, and much of the praise surrounding him is based on projecting potential.

2nd Round: Ray Ray Armstrong
6’4, 215 pounds | Safety | Miami
First word: How good is Ray Ray Armstrong? He lives up to his number, 26. It’s quite a feat considering it was worn by former Miami star Sean Taylor. It’s easy to compare the two. Like Taylor, Armstrong is a big, physical safety with solid coverage skills. NFL teams are already getting in touch with Armstrong’s high school coaches to get more background on the junior.

Armstrong started only four games of the 2010 season, but saw significant playing time throughout the year. He finished 2010 with 76 tackles and three interceptions (taking one back for a touchdown).

3rd round: James-Michael Johnson | 6’2, 240 pounds | MLB | Nevada
"Nevada defenders have a tough time trying to make people take notice of their play because of the team’s offense, which ranked fourth in the FBS in total yardage in 2010. But Johnson’s toughness and production has not escaped notice of WAC coaches, who named him second-team all-conference in each of the last two seasons, and NFL scouts.

Johnson played in all 13 games with 10 starts as a redshirt freshman. Included in his 49 tackles were 12.5 for a loss, and he also had 1.5 sacks, an interception and forced fumble. He started every game over the next two seasons, making 57 tackles, 11.5 for loss, and five pass break-ups on the outside in 2009 before moving to the middle as a junior (88 tackles, eight TFL, 2.5 sacks, three forced fumbles).

Teams running base schemes should see Johnson as one of the top true mike linebackers in this draft because of his ability to come downhill against the run. If he proves himself athletically in a post-season all-star game and the Combine could push him into the top 100 overall selections.

4th Round: Adrian Robinson | 6’2, 250 pounds | DE/OLB | Temple
"As a prolific pass rusher (33 sacks his last two seasons) and Most Valuable Player of the famed "Big 33" all-star game between the top high school prospects from Ohio and Pennsylvania (three sacks, blocked punt), Robinson could have matriculated to Penn State or a host of other prominent programs. He surprisingly chose Temple, though, because he knew then-head coach Al Golden had the football team going in the right direction and he "liked being the underdog."

Golden got Robinson’s talent on the field right away, playing him in all 12 games and starting him at defensive end the final three contests (20 tackles, 1.5 TFL, sack). Robinson’s break-out sophomore season earned him MAC Defensive Player of the Year accolades after racking up 13 sacks and forcing five fumbles. Though his numbers were down in his junior season (38 tackles, 4.5 TFL, 3.5 sacks, three forced fumbles), league coaches saw enough of his game to once again name him first-team All-MAC.

Though Robinson is listed as a defensive end, Temple coaches have played him all over the field. In addition to rushing the passer with his hand on the ground, Robinson played outside the tackle, over the tight end, and at the second level in a stack. New defensive coordinator Chuck Heater may play him as a more traditional 4-3 end like he did Jermaine Cunningham and other undersized ends while at Florida, but the versatility Robinson showed during his career may push 3-4 teams looking for powerful linebackers to select him early in the 2012 draft.

5th round: John Cullen | 6’4, 305 pounds | OT | Utah
Is far from a finished product, but there is some real natural athleticism there. Needs to get stronger and develop as a puncher, but has to take that next step as a player. Struggles vs. better competition."

6th round: Phillip Blake | 6’3, 320 pounds | C | Baylor
Pass Blocking: Former right tackle possesses the length and footwork to mirror any interior lineman. Plays with low center of gravity, natural bend and lateral quickness. Flashes a strong enough anchor to pancake overextended defenders, but can be pushed backwards when his hands aren’t on his man’s numbers. Also gets out-quicked when hand placement is off. Reliable, accurate shotgun snapper.

Run Blocking: Strong run blocker capable of moving the nose tackle to his left or right with his upper body. Agile enough to seal to either side when uncovered. Inconsistent down-blocking and finding the mike linebacker on combo blocks in tight quarters, gets stuck at the line at times instead of moving to second level. Inconsistent intensity and hand placement to sustain after initial contact. Stops his feet too often, losing his balance or allowing his man comes off his block. Stays low, gets some movement in short-yardage situations but typically just holds the line.

7th round: Derek Moye | 6’5, 202 pounds | WR | Penn State
Impression: A big wide out who uses his skill set to get off press and has some sneaky strider speed down the field. Isn’t going to separate a ton in the NFL, but can win in the three step game, work the middle of the field."

by MacDeezul on Jan 4, 2012 5:36 AM PST up reply actions  

Yeah, this fanpost is a reaction to your fanpost.

1st round: I wouldn’t hate the idea of a CB. But CBs are a crapshoot at best in any round. OLs in the first, however, almost never bust. We need an OL at least as bad as we need a CB. OLB is an even bigger need, if a good prospect is available. Probably not….

2nd and 3rd: We need an OLB, and this draft is deep in day-2 talent. The other pick could be a CB, but after the first round there’s often a big dropoff in CB talent. Another OL is a possibility if he’s a value pick, which is more likely for a Guard or RT (just what we need). Gaither, 1st-rounder, Hardwick, Vasquez, 2nd-rounder. Clary is always good for competition: he’s a credible NFL player, even if that’s his absolute ceiling.

Day 3: BPA in almost every round, with a preference for DBs and pass-rushers, and at least one OLB. If the first OLB came in the third round, then maybe we should try to get another one in round 4 or 5; if in the first or second, then only in round 4 or 5 if it’s a good pick.

McNeill has real trade value if he plays on. He’ll have to pass a physical, of course, but a long contract with Gaither would make him extraneous: we could easily trade McNeill and Clary for a high second-rounder to a team that doesn’t like its OTs. They ain’t cheap, but they ain’t bad, either.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 4, 2012 7:59 PM PST up reply actions  

Oh, and we don't need a safety.

We’ve got mediocre safeties coming out our ears, plus one studly one. That’s good enough.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 4, 2012 8:01 PM PST up reply actions  

Disagree, respectfully of course.

Our “mediocre” safeties, in my opinion are special teamers and should only be on the defensive side of the ball 3 or 4 plays in a game to give our starters a rest when needed. To me they are better at stopping the run than at defending the pass – they are undersized with average quickness, slow, and not good play-makers when the ball is in the air. You can get by with them with a dominant front seven I guess but therein lies the question when it comes to the defense I think. Which area is easier to fix more quickly – the front seven or the defensive back field?

by MacDeezul on Jan 5, 2012 5:58 AM PST up reply actions  

Seeing as we have six of the front seven locked up

but average/limited guys in three of the back four positions, I’d say we get the best bang for our buck by bringing in a bunch of rush linebackers, preferably bigger ones (because we have good pure speed-rushers).

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 7:51 AM PST up reply actions  

Shaun Phillips

You think (a healthy) Shaun Phillips can get his “swagger” back as an outside pass-rushing threat? Does he still have some “prime” years ahead of him? If he is/can then getting another outside threat would be interesting to see I think – if both ends can tie up their Tackle/RB then that one OLB should be in the QBs face all game long….

by MacDeezul on Jan 5, 2012 10:53 AM PST up reply actions  

Between Phillips, LaBoy, and Barnes, we have a starting OLB.

The problem is that LaBoy + Barnes = one starter, and Phillips is no longer young.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 2:27 PM PST up reply actions  

Getting rid of LaBoy

is addition by subtraction.

If the thunder don't get ya then the lightning will!!

Robert Hunter

by Buck Melanoma on Jan 7, 2012 8:28 AM PST up reply actions  

Meh, he's an NFL player.

He can be a good part of a corps. He’s just not a starter.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 7, 2012 11:54 AM PST up reply actions  

LaBoy was actually not terrible (not good either). He was just asked to do more than he's capable of.

Bolts from the Blue // "At least when Wade is spewing vitriol he does so with an intellectual flair." - insanebolt21
Bloody Elbow // "I think we're poking fun at Leland's 'boner.'" - Michael Fagan

by Richard Wade on Jan 8, 2012 10:50 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Can I take it you don't think QJ can make the transition?

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 8:29 AM PST up reply actions  

No I think he can.

I think he has the physical skills to defend well at the position. Always been a good tackler. Physical enough to play ruff with the tight ends. Still has enough speed to run with a tight end. But if he gets locked onto the wrong slot receiver…… Actually I wanted him to make the move 2 years ago but the Chargers never seemed to interested in picking up a CB who could put him there.

by MacDeezul on Jan 5, 2012 10:49 AM PST up reply actions  

So, SS situation solved.

Okay, now that makes more sense. I’d still rather see a big-name free agent than a high draft pick, but the idea of revamping the secondary with an expensive body is pretty reasonable if you think of us as having a stud SS already.

I’m just not so sure. The best FA CB option for us available would be Carlos Rogers or Brandon Carr. I don’t think any rookie will be a step up; those guys would be, but how much?

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 2:42 PM PST up reply actions  

"After the 1st round there's often a big dropoff in CB talent"

This is the reason why I think we need to focus our attention at the CB position in the first round – due to the availability of talent and potential game one starters. But yeah you are right that it can be crap shoot if you don’t do your homework. Added to the fact you can’t take a CB who is the prototypical “cover-2” corner and throw him in a press-man defensive scheme and expect him to succeed right away.

Q Jammer has been saying for years that he would gladly move back to safety if they found someone who can beat him out at CB…… well if they can’t find that player this year then……

by MacDeezul on Jan 5, 2012 5:54 AM PST up reply actions  

It's a crapshoot if you DO do your homework.

High injury rate among youngster CBs, and any slowdown is a career-ender. You can’t tell if they’re NFL tough until they have to prove it in the regular season. (This is even worse for receivers, but CBs have it too.) Rookie CBs almost always struggle if forced to start. It takes a couple years to build a DB, like a DL or ILB.

I just don’t think you can plug short-term secondary holes in the draft. The only consistent plug-and-play rookie defenders are pure pass-rushers. Rushing the passer, running the ball, and run-blocking from the line, those are the skills that have the smallest learning curves, the places where you’re most likely to get a day-one starter, assuming you hit on a quality player. Pass-rushers are easy to predict, too, which is why we were all so dismayed when AJ picked English over Matthews. The only problem is that they’re so subject to injury.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 8:05 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

OMG!!

Go read this article: http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/01/12/cornerbacks-a-glance-at-the-2011-numbers/

After reading that tell me that DB (specifically CB) is not a need?! With stats like that it makes you wonder if Q-Jam is even fit to play SS!

I know you and I have been round and round on this matter but ge-golly-whizzle! He (Q-Jam) is the worst in the league and he’s our #1?!! But to your argument as well, those rookies who were selected at CB last year didn’t bode so well either – at least not early on in the season (Patrick Peterson)…… but in some cases they still did better than Q-Jam.

by MacDeezul on Jan 13, 2012 6:23 AM PST up reply actions  

What about the kid from Boise St.

What’s his name, Kellen Moore I think (the QB). Smaller guy, not a strong arm, but seems to know how and when to place the ball. Made a career of winning the big games. Maybe if drops down to 7th round or goes undrafted we could bring him in as a project backup? Or do you think that someone is going reach for him in earlier rounds?

by MacDeezul on Jan 6, 2012 5:05 AM PST up reply actions  

I don't know much about collegiate QBs

I pretty much follow the pro game, which is a large part of why I don’t make specific recommendations on draft picks after the first round. But a day-3 QB who could develop into a good backup sounds good to me. Just not before round 5.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 6, 2012 8:46 AM PST up reply actions  

Case Keenum (mentioned earlier) and Kellen Moore

are both smaller guys that remind me (and others) of Drew Brees. Brees took a couple of years to figure out the pro game and come into his own, but really required the proper system to fully make his mark on the league. I do not believe that either of those guys translate well into the type of offense we are running now. A guy with the skill set and size that we have gotten familiar with over that last few years is right up the road at Montezuma Mesa — Ryan Lindley.

North Texas REALLY needs a Rubio's franchise.

by SDNativeinTX on Jan 6, 2012 10:41 AM PST up reply actions  

Lacks pro-level accuracy

IMO, that makes him undraftable. Accuracy almost never improves beyond the 2nd-year collegiate starter level.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 7, 2012 5:22 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

So bang for the buck and

immediate impact you prefer we go OL in the 1st because 1st round OLs tend to have a more consistent performance as a starter, then in the 2nd OLB because of the same reason in addition to there generally being a higher quantity of quality players comming out in that position – possibly doubling up with another one in the 3rd or spending that 2nd on ???. And then in the 3rd take a DB?

You are satisfied (for the moment) with our SS play/depth so would you try and find that CB with the 2nd/3rd depending upon who is available? I think the talent drop off after the 1st 2 rounds is too great to wait until the 3rd round or later to address the DB (CB or SS).

by MacDeezul on Jan 5, 2012 11:09 AM PST reply actions  

I just don't think our DB situation is urgent.

I see Cason/Gilchrist as average, and average as good enough if the pass-rush is going. If we want an immediate improvement, we can get a guy in FA. I’d recommend a tall sideline corner to fill the gap vacated by Jammer.

Unless they can pick up a day 2 pick for McNeill or a stud CB or SS falls through the cracks to the third round, I’d almost rather they didn’t spend a high draft pick on the secondary. I’d like to see them bite hard on the offensive line, dominate the game, make opposing offenses have to score on every possession. Instead of being satisfied with “high-flying” on O, I’d rather see us get back to “legendary” status.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 5, 2012 2:33 PM PST up reply actions  

I agree with your point about the secondary related to pass rush

The NYG are in the playoffs now with D backfield of guys that were on practice squads or the street in early September. But only because they have multiple high quality pass rushers. The Giants also have the advantage of playing in a division with teams that all had serious flaws this year; something they have in common with the Bolts.

North Texas REALLY needs a Rubio's franchise.

by SDNativeinTX on Jan 6, 2012 10:45 AM PST up reply actions  

The Chargers need

to find another OLB to pair with Phillips. Barnes is a great rotational player but not the ideal every down Backer. Not only was the Chargers linebacker pass rush inconsistent this year, teams chose to run the ball at the Outside Backers with good results. SP is solid but the others struggled pretty bad at times. I don’t know if that player is in the draft this year or if I would want to spend another 1st round pick hoping. Maybe a 2nd or later,

Another area the Chargers struggled mightily in was defending Tight Ends. (Actually have struggled for a few years). A Strong Safety to pair with Weddle I think would go along way in fixing both TE coverage and run support. A name I saw on the FA list that caught my eye is Oakland’s Safety Tyvon Branch. I watch him defend Gates very well anytime matched up against him and is always making plays around the line of scrimmage. Plus, it wouldn’t be making the Raiders any better!

So…
If Dean and AJ really mean what they say and want to win now, I think they need to do whatever is necessary to get a proven edge rusher/run defender. Dare I say… Super Mario… I know keep dreaming!

by ttawdvr4 on Jan 5, 2012 8:22 PM PST reply actions  

Yup. A pass-rusher is a critical need.

But they need an immediate impact player who can rush the passer NOW and build into a solid run-stopper. Guys like Gamble and Barnes are very one-dimensional; LaBoy and English are good backups, but neither is the starter going forward (English could have been, but for his bum foot). The run defense will suffer until they put in some beef opposite Phillips.

An autumn Sunday,
Perched in front of the big screen,
Beer in white knuckles.

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Jan 6, 2012 8:49 AM PST up reply actions  

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