5 Bad Things: KC Chiefs at SD Chargers
Philip Rivers
3 games: 7 turnovers, 6 sacks, 4 TDs. A QB rating of 82.1, which is worse than any season that he's had as a starter so far. It's not too complicated, without Antonio Gates this team rests solely on the shoulders of El Capitan. While we trust him and believe in him to be a great QB, everyone has a period where things just aren't going their way. Unfortunately for Philip, everything is going wrong for him at a time when his team needs him the most.
In this game, Rivers finished 24/38 for 266 yards, 2 sacks, 2 interceptions and a fumble that was recovered by his offensive line. He looked inaccurate and out of sorts for most of the game. A similar performance against the Dolphins would be disastrous.
Antoine Cason
It's been a rough start to the season for Antoine, who was absolutely abused by Dwayne Bowe in the second half of yesterday's game. I'm going to be optimistic for a second and attribute his slow start to the broken hand and time missed in training camp, which would mean that a return to his 2010 form is coming. That being said, I'd rather not see what happens if Antoine has to cover Brandon Marshall for the entire game next Sunday.
Health
Boy, the defensive line is starting to remind me of 2009. You don't remember the Chargers 2009 defensive line? Do the names Ian Scott and Alfonso Boone help jar your memory?
It appears the Chargers always get injuries in a particular group or groups instead of spread all over the roster, and this year that group seems to be DEs. Starters Luis Castillo and Corey Liuget missed the KC game. Jacques Cesaire left and didn't return. If you were to tell Greg Manusky that, at some point this season. he would be coaching with Ogemdi Nwagbuo and Vaughn Martin as his starters at DE (with no backups behind them) he would probably start pinching himself and crying to the heavens to wake up.
The thing with injuries in the NFL is that they happen to everybody. The teams that succeed are the ones that turn losses into opportunities and find new ways to win.
Bryan Walters
I am reserving this spot for "Wes Welker" (the quotes make it so everyone will get the joke this time, right?) until he is taken off punts or improves. Wes had punt returns of 5 yards and 4 yards, and again did that thing where he catches the ball in traffic just to see if someone can hit him at the right moment and make him fumble the ball on the Chargers own 10 yard line. He's a treasure.
Earlier in the week, I had been tweeting at Patrick Crayton about being upset that he was taken off of the punt return depth chart. He sent me back a vague reply that seemed to imply that he'd be returning those this week. Imagine my horror when I saw Welker back there, making mistake after mistake and not getting reprimanded for them.
Pass Rush
Wow, heck of an offensive line they have in Kansas City, huh? The only person that seemingly got near Matt Cassel all day was Antwan Barnes, when he sacked him on his second attempt because Matt was apparently in the middle of a particularly entertaining chapter of Twilight and didn't want to interrupt it by throwing the ball.
That OLB spot across from Shaun Phillips is a giant weakness, the type of weakness that contending teams do not have on their roster, and it was made worse by Bob Sanders not being in the game to occasionally blitz. Plain and simple, Greg Manusky (like most other DCs around the league) is trying to create pressure without sacrificing too much in coverage and it's not working. When Matt Cassel looks comfortable and has time to throw accurately downfield, it's time to change what you're doing.
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Rivers' "Injury"
I keep seeing people blaming Rivers’ play on a mysterious injury. Sure, he’s dinged up from that hit in the Pats game and a few against the Chiefs, but most of the interceptions have been from plain old dumb decisions. I haven’t seen him chuck a ball off his back foot like that in years. Remember when he used to do that?
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
Did Jammer's injury hurt more than the DL injuries?
I’d say yes, which is a testament to the DL depth and perhaps an indictment of the CB depth…
Seems like we were forced to limit the defensive playbook with Gilchrist in there. I saw a lot of zone which really only works if the offense isn’t ready for it. If they are, it is a just a matter of picking it apart.
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Sep 26, 2011 10:13 AM PDT reply actions
Pass rush...
It’s also hurting due to no Castillo and everyone else hurt.
Cason Had great coverage on Bowe on the TD. It was just a perfect pass. He just needs a bit more awareness when the ball is in the air.
Dielman on Rivers: "I've tried to get him to say s--- or f--- and all he'll ever do is say, 'Golly gee, I can't do that."
by Superduperboltman on Sep 26, 2011 10:28 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Like the throw to beaston
Two sheep, one profile
"9 out of 10 Americans believe that out of 10 people, 1 American will always disagree with the other 9" -Colin
by Lmbs2slaghtr on Sep 26, 2011 10:38 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
I think "beaston" is Breaston's Twitter handle
by Andy (allfield) on Sep 26, 2011 10:52 AM PDT up reply actions
I blame auto-correct
Two sheep, one profile
"9 out of 10 Americans believe that out of 10 people, 1 American will always disagree with the other 9" -Colin
by Lmbs2slaghtr on Sep 26, 2011 10:53 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Well, it's better than his original Twitter handle: "breast-man"
by Andy (allfield) on Sep 26, 2011 10:54 AM PDT up reply actions
And Cosmo Kramer is the Assman.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 11:00 AM PDT up reply actions
i've learned...
that when i don’t know what someone is talking about that kinda sounds like a joke, it’s usually a Seinfeld reference…
"Watch out where the huskies go, don't you eat that yellow snow."- Zappa
Most things in life are Seinfeld references
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Also, some well timed holding prevented a couple sacks.
Bolts from the Blue // "I eat cereal out of a giant novelty wine glass because it makes me feel fancy." - Britney Wade
Bloody Elbow // "I think we're poking fun at Leland's 'boner.'" - Michael Fagan
by Richard Wade on Sep 26, 2011 10:53 AM PDT up reply actions
How come we can't do that?
Oh yeah, the refs are out to get us
Two sheep, one profile
"9 out of 10 Americans believe that out of 10 people, 1 American will always disagree with the other 9" -Colin
by Lmbs2slaghtr on Sep 26, 2011 11:02 AM PDT via mobile up reply actions
And they hate Mike Vick
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 11:32 AM PDT up reply actions
they actually kinda do
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
You reap what you sow.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions
BS illegal contact.
and during my film review, only saw one blatant hold not called
Dielman on Rivers: "I've tried to get him to say s--- or f--- and all he'll ever do is say, 'Golly gee, I can't do that."
by Superduperboltman on Sep 26, 2011 1:58 PM PDT up reply actions
would help to cause a turnover too
and i dont count weddles pick, cassel forgot what team he was on and threw it too him.
game winning TO
from what I’ve read, sounds like it was a play Weddle recognized and altered his blitz from practice/film and put himself near the play.
Game winning turn overs are like wins, I’ll take ’em no matter how they come.
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Sep 26, 2011 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
This is what happened.
He was blitzing, read screen and fell back with the guard who was pulling and the ball ended up in his hands.
Luck is the meeting of preparation and opportunity.
by Alex Bourque on Sep 26, 2011 11:55 AM PDT up reply actions
stats question
i’d be curious to see an argument that accounts for the decline in his performance using stats to support it. what i’m really wondering is, does the blame fall on PR 17, or on the line, or on norv or other coaching staff, and i’m curious about whether statistics can actually give us a clearer answer.
and yes, i do realize the undertaking would probably be extensive given how important everyone else on the team is to evaluating the performance of individual players. i’m not asking anyone to do it, i’m just wondering if it’s possible, and if so, what stats one should consider.
Players play coaches coach
PR does not design the plays, nor does he call them. And, does not decide who gets injured. unfortunately we do not have a system where TE or the parts in general are interchangeable. sorry, but no amount of stats will change, “it is what it is.”
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
What I am seeing
And what I am viewing as most concerning is Rivers footwork (mechanics) he is not stepping into his throws. That 1st INT yesterday was yet another perfect example of him not stepping forward and throwing off his back foot..maybe the d-line is pushing his o-line so far back and he is afraid he can’t step
Well
he shouldn’t have thrown into that coverage. It looked like at least two, maybe three Chiefs on that route to me. You don’t throw there.
To me, it looks like defenses are taking those deep routes away, and he will take the check downs for a while, but then gets frustrated and tries to force throws into windows that aren’t there. You don’t really need to any fancy stats analysis, all you have to look at is 4TDs to 7 turn overs, project that and it’s like 37 turnovers and 21 TDs for the year.
For all the pissing and moaning about Norv, it’s actually kind of impressive that they are 2-1 at this point. I love Rivers and think he will figure it out, but he has not been good these first three games. Heck, even the Pats lost when Brady threw for four picks.
The play of chance and probability within which the creative spirit is free to roam. -von Clausewitz 'On Football'
by Brian (DaBolts) on Sep 26, 2011 11:08 AM PDT up reply actions
He may be forcing some deep throws
but two of his picks this season have been by defensive lineman on poorly thrown balls to RBs on very short routes. I think he has been equal opportunity on his poor throws when it comes to long and short passes.
Some
have been head-scratcher’s for sure; the one that Wilfork got seemed flukey. I guess I’m forgetting the other short one. There was a Chief LB who just flat out dropped a reasonably short one. Good points…
The play of chance and probability within which the creative spirit is free to roam. -von Clausewitz 'On Football'
by Brian (DaBolts) on Sep 26, 2011 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions
I was thinking of the one
he tried to force to RM when Allen was on him. It was a great play by Allen but RM was covered and the ball wasn’t going to fit in there.
Right
How do I forget Jared Allen dropping into coverage? That was awesome.
The play of chance and probability within which the creative spirit is free to roam. -von Clausewitz 'On Football'
by Brian (DaBolts) on Sep 26, 2011 1:03 PM PDT up reply actions
"Statistically"...
My math teacher background insists that I place the blame on “small sample size”. It’s still too early in the season to make any meaningful predictions. Even Football Outsiders is with me on this: since they’ve seen little to no correlation between performance in an early game and performance in a late one, they actually drop any games played more than 10 weeks prior. In week 13, this game’s performance will have little to no bearing on how we do that week.
In the future though, more things will be come clear. I recommend advancednflstats.com, the guy who runs that site is pretty solid.
I rewatched the game yesterday
Is Rivers hurt or just momentarily losing his mind when he throws these picks. A few have literally been unpressured throws to the other teams
Winning
He has seemed generally out of sync. He had some really ugly incompletions too. It also seems like there is less zip on some of his throws.
Chris Chambers Joke
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 11:21 AM PDT up reply actions
Ya, the OLine does not look playoff caliber
Center and both guards struggling. PR is a step up and throw guy. Not enough room to step up.
Is something different this year?
I’m kind of surprised this year by the extra amount of doom and gloom at this point of the season. If you had asked an average, slightly cynical but realistic Chargers fan preseason where we would be right now it would be 2-1, comprised of:
1. A so-so win against an average Vikings, with our obligatory slow start and mixed performances. Doing enough to win – just. Unsurprising – a slow start that could have been worse.
2. An improved showing but inevitable foot shooting against the pretty good Pats on their turf. Everything goes right for them, nothing for us – no surprise there either.
3. A sloppy win against a bad and depleted KC, who you kind of knew after their first two poundings would allow us into a dogfight at their level. Because that’s what usually happens when we play them, no matter our respective standings.
So we are 2-1. Pretty much as expected.
The good thing we had hoped for (but couldn’t rely on, or even know what it might be) has happened ie Ryan Matthews has progressed to be a real offensive threat.
The bad thing that we can never predict, but invariably occurs, has occurred. This year, so far, it’s the “offness” of Rivers. I don’t think he’s been bad, he just hasn’t been PR good.
The bad thing that we had hoped wouldn’t occur, but really should have expected, has – ie Injuries. But it could have been worse, most teams are getting dinged up this year, and we have 2 highly winnable games then a bye. Our early bye might turn out to be fortuitous to get some guys healthy.
I think our season in a lot of ways really starts now. At 2-3 or even 3-2 at the bye we will be in a real scrap for the division. But we have a real shot at 4-1. Yes, the manner of the win against KC wasn’t very satisfactory and some key elements are misfiring, but a W is a W and in perverted way I’d prefer us to have plenty to work on and improvement to make than sit around discussing perfect performances. We are definitely out of synch, but it can be a pretty fine line between a misfiring engine and a well oiled machine. A tweak here, a bit of luck there. Confidence builds, and things start to go right. I still believe we can, and will be, that machine, and at the right time of the season.
It's NEVER a shrimp on the barbie. It's not even a shrimp.
by The Land Of Real Beer on Sep 26, 2011 11:15 AM PDT reply actions 6 recs
A W is W...so that's the chat?
this is a fraise that will be eaten, by those who use it. to be continued come playoff time.
nice post though. rec
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
It might catch on.
It’s being said a lot in Pittsburgh today too.
It's NEVER a shrimp on the barbie. It's not even a shrimp.
by The Land Of Real Beer on Sep 26, 2011 11:45 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
And i've seen their schedule.
really? a superbowl team, with “That” schedule.
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
I'm with you.
I won’t speak for anyone else, but I remember the early ‘00s. Us leading by 3, other team has the ball for the last possession of the game? We’d end up losing that game. EVERY TIME. No exceptions.
The results are about what we expected ...
but the level of play has allowed the cynical element to flourish.
that's not where i'm at...
A “Win is a Win” is a cliche, but very true and desired. believe me i’m all for it. However there are genuine concerns about the way the team is playing, a lot of talk on how it’s going to be fixed and we end up with the same results since 07’. it can get frustrating, and the one voice of reason on this board, John Gennaro, has been sharing his pain as of late.
Now, i believe the Chargers can make the playoffs, but it always seems the things i’m "cynical " about now, seem to be the very same things that get them bumped early in the post season. It’s early with plenty of football left to play.
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
why do you have to trash the bolts?! can you think of nothing good to say??? 4-3!!!!!!!!!!
(am i doin it right??)
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
I with justdave
way too much negativity. Why can’t we have a weekly “5 good things” post?
I’m never coming back again!!!
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Sep 26, 2011 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
Because some weeks
there aren’t 5 good things?
It's NEVER a shrimp on the barbie. It's not even a shrimp.
by The Land Of Real Beer on Sep 26, 2011 11:47 AM PDT up reply actions
Ryan Mathews, Randy McMichael, a turnover on defense, Tolbert didn't dance and nick novak
There ya go
by Alex Bourque on Sep 26, 2011 11:59 AM PDT up reply actions
Sold
Conflicted on Tolbert though. I’d prefer he had a reason to dance… then didn’t.
It's NEVER a shrimp on the barbie. It's not even a shrimp.
by The Land Of Real Beer on Sep 26, 2011 12:25 PM PDT up reply actions
He can dance all he wants
when they play has been blown dead, for all I care.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 12:35 PM PDT up reply actions
I guess I should have clarified where the dancing occurs
RM and Tolbert have a touchdown dance they do together now.
I don’t know if it’s new this year or if they started it last year but
they do it on the sideline after either one of them scores.
Couple hand slaps, they walk past each other then spin around, jump, and do a hip bump. The CBS cutaway during the middle of it after the second TD yesterday.
by Alex Bourque on Sep 26, 2011 1:08 PM PDT up reply actions
It was sarcasm
There is a weekly 5 good things post.
"Beating the Red Sox feels SO GOOD.! SO GOOD! SO GOOD!" -jbox
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
How did Oakland look?
From the highlights they looked like the “bully” they said they’d be. When was the last time we had a team that could stand up to a physical “we are going to pound you for 4 quarters” kinda team? That’s just not a Norv capability.
I don't think Sanchez stopped to eat a hot dog.
It's NEVER a shrimp on the barbie. It's not even a shrimp.
by The Land Of Real Beer on Sep 26, 2011 11:18 AM PDT up reply actions
And LT had a 118 yards against them.
but still lost.
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
through the air
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
Like he wanted to do here.
but didn’t get the opportunity.
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
my point was he didn't rush for 118 yards
they didn’t ground and pound against the Raiders, they tried to finesse them to death.
the Jets aren’t a finesse team… not sure why they are trying to be.
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
I got that part...
My point was LT wanted to be more involved in the passing game, since the new scheme was moving away form the “power” running game here. against the Raiders he showed he could still get it done, catching out of the backfield.
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
whereas we, on the other hand, ARE a finesse team
so we’ll see.
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
I think the team
JUST lacks an identity period.
You may be right
“Finesse” gets bandied about as a criticism a lot. The truth is that there’s nothing wrong with being a finesse team if you do it really well. It’s also fair to say that a finesse team might take longer to get in synch than a smashmouth team, since it’s all about timing. Hell, look at how awful the Colts are on offense without Manning in there.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions
i wasn't using it as a criticism
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
I didn't say you were
I meant “people” in general.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions
very very good point
subtle jab aside
"I suggest more bike" ~KSK
"The Red Sox and Yankees are playing as I type but I don't know who's winning because I don't watch Arena League baseball." - the genius TTG
Destroying your facts with opinions
Our last game this year is against Oakland
It’s early, but I have to wonder if the division will come down to that game.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
In Oakland
McFadden will go all Steven Jackson on us. Can’t blame AJ for the DLine – couldn’t do a whole lot better there. But with McFadden in your division you need a linebacking corp that can stop the run. Remember, when Hank used to say: “You CANNOT run on this Charger defense.” I loved that.
Last I checked
AP was a pretty good runner and SD did well against him.
Dont forget that was with Castillo in the lineup, and Sanders too.
And Liuget.
Dielman on Rivers: "I've tried to get him to say s--- or f--- and all he'll ever do is say, 'Golly gee, I can't do that."
by Superduperboltman on Sep 26, 2011 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions
It does scare me
that the last game is in Oakland. We need to have this thing locked up before then, but I have to say that the schedule looks pretty tough after the bye week.
"The biggest thing..." - Norv Turner
by Cake or Death on Sep 26, 2011 12:28 PM PDT up reply actions
Yes i agree. Hopefully no injuries by then or after the bye week. We got to beat the weak teams and play competitively vs the 10’ playoff teams and squeak out a win and wrap up the division before the week 17 Raiders game.
by AirCoryell74 on Sep 27, 2011 5:31 AM PDT up reply actions
Luckily, by the first oakland game,
Liuget will be back, Sanders may have recovered from his second injury, and maybe, and this is a pray to God every night maybe, Castillo is healthy enough to play solidly. Hopefully.
Dielman on Rivers: "I've tried to get him to say s--- or f--- and all he'll ever do is say, 'Golly gee, I can't do that."
by Superduperboltman on Sep 26, 2011 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions
We have the bye week in Week 6
We get through Miami and Denver with wins and get the rest we desperately need, maybe we’ll have Liuget, Sanders and Phillips ready for the tough stretch ahead.
"follow @radio2012, trust me, you will find his optimism, innocence, and honesty quite refreshing. as a jaded bastard, i sure do." justdave2103
http://twitter.com/#!/radio2012
by Jonathan Holmes on Sep 26, 2011 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Castillo healthy for the 2nd Raiders game hopefully!
by AirCoryell74 on Sep 27, 2011 5:32 AM PDT up reply actions
Cromartie blew the game.
Dielman on Rivers: "I've tried to get him to say s--- or f--- and all he'll ever do is say, 'Golly gee, I can't do that."
by Superduperboltman on Sep 26, 2011 1:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Offensive line stinks
People are saying whats wrong with Rivers. How about getting hit on every pass play. Volick better be ready as Rivers is not going to last at this rate. The OL is getting pushed around especially Clary. Why is this usually solid group not playing up to past years ?
Donzietgr
3 Major Concerns
1- Obviously Rivers and his unusual poor play this season is a big concern but I’m hoping with time (and some bleh opponents coming up: Miami, Denver, BYE) that the offense will build some chemistry or whatever the hell it is they’re lacking before they have to face the likes of Green Bay and the Jets with Captain Broken-Nose. P.S. Hey, O-Line, stop letting your guy get hammered. Thanks.
2- Is it realistic to be worried that Gates may not return to his former form? It’s not hard to see that he’s been as important to Philip as Philip has been to him and his career.
3- The team is -6 in TO differential. Is is just me or has this team EVER (in recent memory) been good at forcing TOs? I know the D was supposedly number 1 last season but… As noted the lack of a pass rush is glaring as all hell. Living in Dallas, I get to see a lot of DeMarcus Ware and I just wish we had someone HALF that good on the other side of Shaun Phillips.

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