NFL Combine - RB Speed Scores
by Wonko on Feb 28, 2010 9:06 PM PST
in NFL Draft
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PrintI know you all have been waiting with baited breath this, so without further ado here's the speed scores from the combine:
| Prospect | College | Weight | 40 time | Speed Score |
| Joique Bell | Wayne State | 220 | 4.65 | 94 |
| Jahvid Best | California | 199 | 4.35 | 111 |
| LeGarrette Blount | Oregon | 241 | 4.62 | 106 |
| Chris Brown | Oklahoma | 210 | 4.58 | 95 |
| Andre Dixon | Connecticut | 205 | 4.64 | 88 |
| Anthony Dixon | Mississippi State | 233 | 4.65 | 100 |
| Jonathan Dwyer | Georgia Tech | 229 | 4.59 | 103 |
| Toby Gerhart | Stanford | 231 | 4.53 | 110 |
| Montario Hardesty | Tennessee | 225 | 4.49 | 111 |
| Javarris James | Miami (FL) | 212 | 4.53 | 101 |
| Stafon Johnson | Southern Cal | 214 | 4.66 | 91 |
| Darius Marshall | Marshall | 190 | 4.56 | 88 |
| Ryan Mathews | Fresno State | 218 | 4.45 | 111 |
| Dexter McCluster | Ole Miss | 172 | 4.58 | 78 |
| Joe McKnight | Southern Cal | 198 | 4.47 | 99 |
| Shawnbrey McNeal | Southern Methodist | 194 | 4.56 | 90 |
| Lonyae Miller | Fresno State | 221 | 4.53 | 105 |
| Pat Paschall | North Dakota State | 209 | 4.69 | 86 |
| Charles Scott | Louisiana State | 238 | 4.67 | 100 |
| C.J. Spiller | Clemson | 196 | 4.37 | 107 |
| James Starks | Buffalo | 218 | 4.5 | 106 |
| Ben Tate | Auburn | 220 | 4.43 | 114 |
| Keith Toston | Oklahoma State | 213 | 4.7 | 87 |
Again, here's the link back to my original post on the subject. As a quick refresher, 100 Speed Score is okay, 110 Speed Score is good or 120 Speed Score is great. I have a few first impressions based on these results. Obviously, Ben Tate did well for himself and since he was already in the conversation for a 3rd round or possibly 2nd round, for me this helps justify that kind of high selection. The top prospect, C.J. Spiller, didn't hurt himself here, so he did what he had to do, but no more. The added weight for Best, plus the higher than expected 40 time really starts to push (or keep) Best into the 1st round. Matthews and Hardesty both upped their stock a little as Matthews' time helps people to imagine him as a first rounder and I have a hard time seeing anyone putting Hardesty below the 3rd round at this point. Gerhart, Starks and Blount all did what they had to do and nothing here changes anything for them. Dwyer, McCluster, McKnight, Bell, Brown, and both Dixons really brought up or kept up questions about their talent level. I'm definitely not comfortable using a 1st rounder on Dwyer now, although in all fairness I was already on the fence about it. Pretty much everyone else wasn't a great prospect to begin with so their times don't matter much and they did nothing to change that.
RB Speed Scores are generated, and researched, by Football Outsiders.
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Bruce Campbell?
What we've got here is a failure to communicate.
by SportsChicken on Feb 28, 2010 10:37 PM PST up reply actions
You are missing a "t"
Mountain West Connection ::Above the Rest::
Bolts From The Blue "There’s a gleam men. Let’s go get the gleam! Focus and Finish!!! One play at a time!!! Let's Go!!!"
it kind of reminds me of that movie "You've got mail"...I'm Tom Hanks he's Meg Ryan -- Padres prospect Matt Antonelli on sdsuaztec4
by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Feb 28, 2010 9:37 PM PST reply actions
Mathews is looking more and more like the best pick at this point
unless someone like Dan Williams falls to the Chargers.
Couldn't agree more
I see it completely the same
Jahvid Best or Ryan Mathews?
I would like to know who you guys would rather have if these guys are both left on the board for our 1rst round pick and all the stud NT or DE etc. are gone. If Sproles is gone than I think Jahvid Best would be the best choice. Even with the risk of his durability!
jahvid best
b/c that guy can break ankles.
Gary Potter: Harness in the good energy, block out the bad. Harness. Energy. Block. Bad. It's like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it. Go with the flow.
Happy Gilmore: Psycho.
That’s who I want.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
I think it will depend on what we get for Cro
If the Chargers get an early to mid 2nd round pick or a pick they can turn into an early 2nd rounder (ie get the Lions 3rd round pick and combine it with our 2nd rounder to move up into the early 2nd) then I think they will wait and draft Mathews or Best somewhere in the early to mid 2nd. If not then AJ will prob use thier 1st rounder to draft the back he feels fits them the best regardless of where they are projected to go.
We still need to wait
For the buzz on Matthews and Best’s medical reports. Assuming they check out okay, I’m guessing both with carry 1st round grades heading into the draft. Waiting until the 2nd round to get either one would probably be a mistake.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
Could be
but I think there may be better players on the board at #28 and still value at running back further down the board.
I mostly agree
Although, in my current rankings that I’ll use for mock drafts I’m probably going to have Matthews and Best ranked as somewhere between the 20th and 25th best prospects. However, there is an opportunity cost there. Even if they were the 35th or 40th best prospects, it means that there is value in selecting them for teams in the early 2nd round who need a RB. Your advice of using a mid second rounder would be banking on teams that could use a RB back passing on them in the early second. That seems a risky gambit at this point. It might just behoove the Chargers to slightly reach so as to avoid being left without a dance partner.
I does depend a lot as to whether the Chargers see the same drop off as I do from Spiller then to Best and Matthews and then to the next tier. To me, if you want to draft a starting RB for 2010, you need to get one from one of those first 2 tiers. Doing otherwise increases the risk of a poor running game for this season. A.J. strikes me as risk averse, so in my mind, he goes for one of those RBs when he knows he can get them.
Unless there is someone at another position that he really likes that falls to 28, then maybe that changes things.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
If the Chargers get the Lions 3rd rounder for cro then they should be able
to move into one of the first three picks in the 2nd round (if they trade thier 2nd rounder along with the third they get from the Lions) assuming they can find a trade partner. The risk would not be as great if they can pull that off but alot of things would have to fall in place for that to happen so who knows.
Still risky
You’d have to find a partner and you never know who is going to dis you because they actually like the guy you want. The path of least resistance is just take the RB in round 1.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
Yep
If we want a top tier back we are going to have to strike at 28. In the late 2nd we would be lucky to have our pick of Tate, McKnight, or Hardesty.
At some point in the first few rounds we’re going to have to reach for a RB, that much Im almost certain.
My worthless opinion is that we wait until the 2nd and take one of the three backs I mentioned above. And just go BPA in the first at DB, Dline or OT.
And then come back to the running back position in the 4th or 5th.
After that 40 time and McKnight's size and some of his maturity issues
I wouldn’t put him in the 2nd round anyway. More like 4th or 5th.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
2nd round guys
Would be guys like Tate and Hardesty, plus Gerhart and Dwyer.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
I wouldn't be up in arms if we drafted any of those guys
For what its worth I had a dream last night that Gerhart was in a Chargers uniform, which is pretty weird since I don’t regularly have dreams involving football, especially not draft prospects. Doubt it means anything though!!
I'm trying to imagine
A 6 ft, 230 lb white guy carrying the ball in a Chargers uniform following a pulling Dielman off tackle.
I can’t see it. Your dreams and mine do not coincide.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
When I tried to imagine it in my head
If I tried to imagine Toby Gerhart as Black it wouldn’t make much sense would it?
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
I thought you meant,
trying to imagine a white running back in the NFL. Hard to come by. But I believe you….
Oh internet, what a wicked web you weave.
Acee did say "mid round pick" in his latest story on the subject
I guess that could mean the high third from Detroit, but that’s borderline “mid round” so I could see where the 4th round pick thoughts could come from.
Man, they must be desperate to be rid of him.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
"Best" change your mind to Matthews!!!
Just in case NO ONE notice! Matthews played 4 games less. FSU had 2 byes, and by week 10 Matthews had ONLY roughly 12 carries in the 4th qtr for the entire season. He hardly played midway 3rd qtr because of COMPASSION! Oh did I mention his senior year of HS he rushed for over 3,000 damn yards. Yes that was the best in the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA. ( LET ME CLARIFY! JUST HIS SENIOR YEAR, OVER 3,000 YARDS. NOT HS CAREER) The last back who had great numbers not attending the Automatic BCS Society and I doubted him to be the real deal just left San Diego and a yellow jacket awaits him.
not to mention he's the closest RB up to
chris johnson speed status.
Gary Potter: Harness in the good energy, block out the bad. Harness. Energy. Block. Bad. It's like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it. Go with the flow.
Happy Gilmore: Psycho.
Johnson's speed score was 121.9
Ben Tate is the one closest to that and really he’s not that close.
Of course, Johnson ran at the RCA Dome, not Lucas Oil Field. But, presumably both Tate and Best would have ran faster there anyway.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
ah i see.
Gary Potter: Harness in the good energy, block out the bad. Harness. Energy. Block. Bad. It's like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it. Go with the flow.
Happy Gilmore: Psycho.
I'm all in on Matthews as well
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
Mathews for me please
Concussions make me nervous.
by Aussiecharger on Mar 1, 2010 5:51 PM PST up reply actions
Matthews
Mountain West Connection ::Above the Rest::
Bolts From The Blue "There’s a gleam men. Let’s go get the gleam! Focus and Finish!!! One play at a time!!! Let's Go!!!"
it kind of reminds me of that movie "You've got mail"...I'm Tom Hanks he's Meg Ryan -- Padres prospect Matt Antonelli on sdsuaztec4
by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Mar 2, 2010 7:05 AM PST up reply actions
Weird
Slow track this year? It seems to me that the times for a lot of these guys (Bell, Blount, the Dixons, Johnson, etc) are relatively slow, at least compared to the big name running backs of years past. McCluster especially seems slow given how fast he looked in games.
I’m sure its a case of selective memory on my part and of course 40 times don’t mean everything, but that’s just my impression from an eyeball test of this table.
I also fear that Gerhart’s stock is going to rise given this data which will make it harder for the Bolts to pick him up in a later round. I was hoping he would be a sleeper pick for them.
Who wants a RB that can barely run a 4.5?
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
Better than a guy who can barely run a 4.6.
Seriously though, there are plenty of guys in the 4.5 area who have been drafted hight, and plenty others who have been successful regardless of their draft position. Shaun Alexander (4.58), Deangelo Williams (4.49), Beanie Wells (4.52). LT ran a 4.46, and Sproles was 4.47, and the difference between that and Gerhart’s 4.53 is minimal.
Of course we all know that 40 times aren’t a great tool for predicting running back success. I wanted Gerhart for his 1800+ yards, 25+ TDs and overall talent. I figured he’d be a good value in the 3rd or 4th, but I doubt he’ll slip that far now.
4.53 was a good time for Gerhart
I don’t know what John is bellyaching about.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
BTW
Gerhart was never going to be a good “sleeper” because of his high level of production in college. Someone is going to like him better than everyone else.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
Ya
That was my impression, but then you see some of these draft boards (take with a whole spoon of salt, of course) who have him listed fairly low. A couple of the guys on ESPN were talking running backs and he didn’t even crack their top 10! That was insane to me and probably wishful thinking on my part that he would be that overlooked, but then again most of the fun of the draft is wishful thinking.
You are correct though, it only takes one team to like him and I’m sure at least one will. Mortensen reported that one unnamed team particularly loved him because of some biomechanical analysis they do of running backs in which he scored particularly well.
It seems to be a slower track
Than the one they had before last year. The last two years have been at Lucas Oil Field as opposed to the RCA dome and the early results are that it might be slower track.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
Jahvid Best
4th fastest 40 times ever according to Acee
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
At least all the guys on the list ran faster than Gartrell
4.75 at the Combine. 4.67 at his own Pro Day.
Seriously, I know that 40 times aren’t everything but I never understood that pick.
I bet some teams would want a RB that can barely run a 4.5 forty
First off I still would take Best but saying who wants a guy that can barely run a 4.5 I think the whole league would in Adrian Peterson!
O.K by no means am I saying Mathews is going to be A.P so please don’t beat me up, but…
Adrian Peterson Combine 40-yard dash 4.40 at combine WT 217
Knowshon Moreno ran in the high 4.5's in the 40 at the combine.
That pick worked out pretty well for Denver. I am still a big believer in the idea that there is a big difference in game speed and track speed. 40 times are much overblown in their supposed importance.
This off-season officially sucks for FIVE reasons and counting...
Did it?
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
947 yards rushing, 7 touchdowns. 213 yards recieving, 2 touchdowns. That is a very solid rookie season.
This off-season officially sucks for FIVE reasons and counting...
I wasn't impressed.
35th most valuable running back by DYAR this past season. 37th by DVOA. Behind Buckhalter in both. Still better than LaMont Jordan, I guess. 45th in receiving DYAR and DVOA among running backs. Well behind Buckhalter in both.
Bolts from the Blue // "He looks like a catfish" - Nick Hardwick on Brandon Siler
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate
You mean
No show Moreno? Did he even play last year. Man that guy made no impact.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
Chris Johnson is the only proof I need
that 40 times do matter.
Oh internet, what a wicked web you weave.
I'm not saying they will all be Chris Johnson
But they do matter.
Oh internet, what a wicked web you weave.
That is just proof
That 40 times are not a substitute for actual scouting.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
what about hardesty?
i only watched a little tennessee ball this year and i didn’t really pay much attention to him…what’s the story on him?…is he worth considering?
"that wasn't a very good start to us getting our lives together. i didn't even go to work today."
...ya'll are brutalizing me... ronnie dobbs
bringing another charger fan into the world for the 2010 season...i hope i get a linebacker
He's absolutely worth considering
But probably not with their 1st round pick. If they get a DT with their 1st rounder, then he would be one of the top candidates for their second round pick along with probably Tate and Gerhart.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
John
I know but Mathews ran an official 4.45
4.40-4.45 are basically the same thing, and if you look at the 40 times recorded from the past there are very few RB’s than ever run under a 4.0 40yd dash
But I’m still with you, I would still rather have Beast, I mean Best!
More Combine notes
Carlos Dunlap came in weighing 277. That’s too light for a 3-4 DE. I had him as the #1 3-4 DE, but that’s not looking realistic anymore. He’s fast enough to play OLB in the 3-4 and that’s looking like a better option, however, he really now seems like he’d be better off on a 4-3 team as DE. Scouts, Inc basically said the same thing on their blog.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
He apparently came across as a complete idiot in his interviews.
That paired with his weight surely has him falling on draft boards.
This off-season officially sucks for FIVE reasons and counting...
This Best Man-Crush explain It.
I’ve watched Jahvid since he got to Cal as a freshman. I’ve never seen him break anyone’s ankles. He’s a rabbit who flies through a hole, a track guy who should run a great 40 – he won the state 100 (anyone remember when Beathard drafted Ray Etheridge, the track guy who was blind in one eye in the second round.) A lot of his TDs were him pitched out, outrunning angles outside -I’m not sure I’ve ever seen him cut back on any of those, even when he got caught by Taylor Mays and others. He didn’t start playing football until like his senior year of HS because his parents were worried about it being too rough. When he got hit at Maryland, it might have literally been the first time he got hit hard. Since then, he’s gone through a bunch of injuries.
Everyone seems to be looking for Chris Johnson but that guy ran a 4.24 and had a ton of carries in college. What makes him special is his toughness and durability for his size, Best hasn’t shown that.
People also seem to have a short term memory for Norv Turner. Last year, Chargers didn’t run much, weren’t successful and threw screens and definitely didn’t have a power running game – I think that had more to do with personnel. Doesn’t mean they’re looking for a bunch of Darren Sproles. Norv got Emmitt Smith well on his way to the NFL all-time yardage lead in Dallas, got Terry Allen and Stephen Davis over 1300 for the Redskins, Ricky Williams over 1800 for the Dolphins, Tyrone Wheatley over 1000 yards for the Raiders, and 1600 yards for Frank Gore in SF. His offenses have a history of pounding the rock on the ground; he just needs a pounder.
Ron Rivera for Cal Head Coach. I'm a one man movement!
by bringbackbuddytrees on Mar 1, 2010 4:49 PM PST reply actions
I agree with much of what you said.
This off-season officially sucks for FIVE reasons and counting...
good for you and you're history lesson.
this guy has crazy acceleration and what are you talking about he just flies through holes. this guy can cut.
toughness and durability for his size? johnson and best have pretty much the same physical attributes.
Gary Potter: Harness in the good energy, block out the bad. Harness. Energy. Block. Bad. It's like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it. Go with the flow.
Happy Gilmore: Psycho.
your*
Gary Potter: Harness in the good energy, block out the bad. Harness. Energy. Block. Bad. It's like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it. Go with the flow.
Happy Gilmore: Psycho.
Ben Tate and others
Guys I love watching the combine but I find It hard to believe guys like tate, who impressed me and in the combine is going to move up from a projected 5th round pick to a 2nd round pick just because of a lower combine time. Those stats are great and all but I would much rather go off of tape. Not saying hes definitely not going to be a good RB in the pros but there were a lot more of these guys college tape that impressed me more than Tate. I’m just saying 2nd round is too early to get him in my opinion just because of his 40 time. I totally agree with caburrito that there are guys that run over a 4.5 or higher that can be successful now in the NFL. Best example is Deangelo Williams who with a guy like McCluster or sproles change of pace RB will take a team from 31st in the league in rushing to top 10 for sure. Even with a strong passing game like we have. I know we can’t get Deangelo but Thomas Jones will be a free agent in a few days and won’t be very expensive. I think hes definitely worth a 2 year contract and great to have him there with a rookie or 2 to mold. He has always been said to be one of the hardest working if not the hardest working guys in the nfl when it comes to training and preparing for games. I’m Just saying! Hes my favorite free agent for us. Not Maurice morris! (I hope that rumor is not true)
Uhh
Tate was getting projections as high as the top of the 3rd before the combine. So it makes sense to think that this solidifies him in that area.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
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