Approval Ratings: Norv Turner
by John Gennaro on Feb 20, 2010 2:00 PM PST
in San Diego Chargers Approval Ratings
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PrintI know I'm going to end up hating this poll and the comments below. The statements about Norv Turner that I hear from Chargers fans always make me want to scream. There's something about the guy, and I tend to believe it's the way he's been talked about by the national media, that makes people think he's a bad guy or a buffoon.
However, there are a good amount of Charger fans that are happy with the job he's done. I happen to be in this group, and I want you to look at a few stats and tell me if you see a bad coach:
- Norv spent nearly 7 seasons as the coach of the Washington Redskins. Considering the team was 4-12 the year before he was hired, we can assume he was brought in to "right the ship" and therefore we can throw out the Redskins 3-13 record in his first season. Taking that out, he finished at an even 46-46 in the regular season (1-1 in the playoffs) in his Washington coaching tenure. Averaging an 8-8 season over 6 seasons (with a team that had been 4-12 when he took over) is not something that a bad coach would do.
- His two seasons in Oakland can be ignored. The season before he took over the team was 4-12 and the season after he left the team was 2-14. As everyone knows, Oakland is a team that lacks talent and does not offer a stable work environment.
- In three seasons as the Chargers Head Coach, Turner has won two-thirds of his regular season games (32-16) and has won the division each season. He is 3-3 in the playoffs with San Diego. Hired to assist in the development of Philip Rivers, the QB's rating has gone from a respectable 92 in 2006 to an unbelievable 105.5 in 2008 and 104.4 in 2009.
Here's what the above tells me: Norv is not the coach that is going to get an untalented team to the playoffs. There are a few coaches that can do that, albeit inconsistently, and Norv is not one of them. However, as the level of talent on the team improves (from Oakland to Washington to San Diego), so does his success. So as long as you give Norv a team that has the talent to win, he's going to guide them towards fulfilling that potential.
Just my two cents. Vote as you'd like.
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Positive so far.
Sooner or later though, the Hacksaw listeners will arrive.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Feb 20, 2010 2:52 PM PST reply actions
Highly approve. For the most part.
But no coach is perfect and they are all going to make bone-head decisions from time to time.
Mountain West Connection ::Above the Rest::
Bolts From The Blue "There’s a gleam men. Let’s go get the gleam! Focus and Finish!!! One play at a time!!! Let's Go!!!"
it kind of reminds me of that movie "You've got mail"...I'm Tom Hanks he's Meg Ryan -- Padres prospect Matt Antonelli on sdsuaztec4
by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Feb 20, 2010 2:54 PM PST reply actions
I listen to Reason, not Hacksaw
Norv is without a doubt an exceptional QB coach, a fairly accomplished OC, a decent fellow by all appearances, a so-so game manager, good football guy and one hell of a recreational card player but he is a lousy Leader of Men with a hapless, aw-shucks demeanor that inspires absolutely no one and he is simply not Head Coach material. That viewpoint may be shared by the national media but it also aligns with what my eyes tell me. He led a supremely talented team to an 8-8 record last year and then was outclassed and out-coached by an inferior team in this years home playoff game. When you unabashed Norv apologists throw out these meaningless numbers that are somehow supposed to support the idea that Norv is some kind of Ara Parseghian-Vince Lombardi hybrid Svengali it makes ME want to scream. What am I missing? Enlighten me. Please. I would genuinely love to be convinced.
by Rocket Surgery on Feb 20, 2010 3:02 PM PST reply actions 2 recs
"He led a supremely talented team to an 8-8 record last year"
What part of “no pass rush at all” tells you they were supremely talented?
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 20, 2010 4:36 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Your eyes vs. stats/logic
If your only reasoning for not thinking he’s a good coach is trusting what your eyes tell you, you will never be convinced otherwised.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 20, 2010 4:38 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I voted "Approve"
and don’t have any problem with Norv as the Head Coach.
But I think you guys are being a little harsh with “Rocket Surgery”, he gave multiple reasons as to why he voted “Disapprove”. Others may, or may not, agree with his reasons and while I think that things like demeanor and leadership are hard to measure unless you are actually a member of the team, those were some of his thoughts on the subject.
i agree.
Gary Potter: Harness in the good energy, block out the bad. Harness. Energy. Block. Bad. It's like a carousel. You put the quarter in, you get on the horse, it goes up and down, and around. Circular, circle. Feel it. Go with the flow.
Happy Gilmore: Psycho.
The whole demeanor thing
Is so overrated.
As long as his players see him as a leader and, unless they are the best liars ever, they do then I don’t really think it matters if anyone outside the organization thinks about his leadership.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
by Wonko on Feb 20, 2010 4:47 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
No, no. You're doing it wrong.
He’s a lousy Leader of Men.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Feb 20, 2010 5:05 PM PST up reply actions
good one, guy
When you look at Norv Turner do you think, “now there goes a guy that people would run through a brick wall for”? Or, “man, that guy looks like he is in total control out there”? I don’t. And I really don’t think the players do, either. He looks unsure, lost and flummoxed to me most of the time and it seems as if the Chargers win (the games they should win, never the ones they shouldn’t) in spite of him, not because of him. I can count on an Arab thief’s hand how many times I thought to myself after a victory, “boy, if we didn’t have Norv Turner running the show there is no way we win that game.” You may say that demeanor doesn’t matter or that it is irrelevant but I respectfully disagree completely. People that are confident and in control look that way and it is certainly a characteristic in the Head Coaches we hold in high esteem.
Also, do you really think when an athlete gives an interview that they are being completely forthcoming and candid? Of course not, they regurgitate the company line or find themselves out of a job. Have you noticed the way Philip Rivers interacts with Norv on the sideline sometimes? It seems like he is continually on the verge of putting his hand up in Norv’s face. And I’m fairly sure LDT thinks that Norv is a clown, too. Now I realize that I am basing these assessments on what my eyes tell me (which apparently you are not supposed to do) but logic and stats have told me that the guy is a loser, too. I’m not sure what other rubric to use here that will tell me otherwise. Winning the moribund AFC West a few times just doesn’t do it for me. Norv Turner is fool’s gold.
by Rocket Surgery on Feb 21, 2010 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
logic and stats have told me that the guy is a loser, too
Because he hasn’t won the Super Bowl in his first 3 seasons? I see no other stats/logic that back up that point. A .667 winning percentage is very, very good.
Maybe you’re not a part of this group, but everyone I’ve met that dislikes Norv because “he doesn’t seem like the type of guy that players will run through a brick wall for” seem to love Marty for exactly the same reason. Where are Marty’s Super Bowl trophies?
When you look at Norv Turner do you think, "now there goes a guy that people would run through a brick wall for"? Or, "man, that guy looks like he is in total control out there"?
And here is why your eyes/opinions can’t make for a worthwhile conclusion: I do think that. When the Chargers are moving down the field with ease, I’m thinking “This guy has been calling plays for 20 years and still nobody has any idea what he’s doing. What a genius.”
I’ve read books, interviews and articles about those motivate-with-fear coaches that supposedly will have players running through a brick wall for them. It’s not the only way to motivate and it’s a good way to get your team to turn on you if you’re not winning. Norv is the type of coach that says “You’re not children and I’m not going to treat you as such.”" That’s the coach that I would play all-out for.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 21, 2010 11:35 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree to disagree and I honestly hope that you are right. And sorry that you don’t find my opinions to be worthwhile. I guess when I see them moving the ball down the field with ease I’m thinking a few things, but “what a genius” is certainly not one of them. More along the lines of: “see, it’s ok to be a pass first offense”, or “holy s&%t, they didn’t run the ball into Hardwick’s back on 1st and 2nd down”, or “damn, Rivers is awesome”, or “god, I love Antonio Gates”, or “I wish we could play the Rams every week”, because when that is happening it seems to be more a product of players winning matchups than Norv out-scheming a defense. That’s just me, I guess. I would like to try on your glasses, though.
As for Marty, I was definitely in the “how many more times do we need to see this guy blow it when it counts before we realize that this is just who he is” camp, but there was something to be said for him getting up someone’s ass and holding them accountable from time to time. You don’t have to be rah-rah to do that. You just have to be the Alpha Dog, which is what I think a Head Coach should be. Whether you choose to admit it or not, a lot of these guys are children mentally and need to be treated as such.
Winning two-thirds of your games is pretty good, but don’t you think just about anyone could do that with this team? And 3 playoff wins is great but two of them were against a team that we just matchup well against and have since before Norv came along. Winning the West and beating the Colts is not impressive enough—that is what they should do. Real winners achieve things that they have no business achieving sometimes and I haven’t seen Norv do that ever, with any team (stats and logic).
by Rocket Surgery on Feb 21, 2010 1:06 PM PST up reply actions
that's one sided..
i have to agree that his demanor is irrelivant. but as far as the players go, they have to see him as the leader. he’s the HC. that’s the way it is, the HC is in charge. they play for him because, well it’s thier job. Marty, Boss Ross, or even Air Coryell is not coming back.
Norv is a good coach. but he’s a .500 HC. only time will tell if he’s a Superbowl winning HC. but for now, it is what it is.
as a fan i’m disappointed in the way the season turned out. join the crowd, so are the fans of 30 other teams. so until my team gets, what every other fan wants for thier team, a lombardi trophy, i guess Norv will always be “second guess”.
peace out
The peanut gallery has spoken!!!
This idea of a "Superbowl winning HC" is kind of a funny one to me
It’s kind of in the same vein as QBs who win the Super Bowl. There’s so much that goes into getting to and winning the Super Bowl that I’m not sure that one individual can propel a team to a Super Bowl appearance and victory. Maybe there have been Head Coaches in the past that have done this, but I would say the majority were average to above average coaches that had things work out for them. It rings especially true when you see the Don Shula’s, Bill Cowher’s and Tony Dungy’s of the world who “can’t win the big one” until they do.
Given how Turner has done the last few years I’m not sure he is any better or worse than Brian Billick, Tom Coughlin, Mike Shanahan, Dick Vermeil, Mike Ditka, George Seifert, Tom Flores and Jon Gruden all of which have won Super Bowls, but will never be in the elite inner circle of greatest coaches of all time. The only argument I could see for many of these guys over Turner is that they won a Super Bowl and that’s sort of a circular argument that I won’t be party to.
And this coming from a guy (me) who doesn’t even like Turner all that much. I just think there is something to be said for consistency and that you’re more likely to find someone worse by jumping back into the pool of coaching candidates. There only so many HOF coaches. I’ll approve of the one that isn’t having any losing seasons, thank you.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
by Wonko on Feb 20, 2010 5:59 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Approve.
I knew that having an anemic/nonexistent running game would finally catch up to us in the playoffs. There is nothing that Norv could have done to offset a patched up o-line and an aging runningback.
It's CaDuck. BAM!!!
Love it...
People make excuses for .500 teams, but they’re still .500 teams at the end of the day.
People make excuses for .500 coaches, but they’re still .500 coaches at the end of the day.
Winners don’t make excuses they find a way to win. Norv hasn’t found a way to win. Sorry to say it, but he’s got something to prove. Until he proves it, he’ll always be a .500 coach in my eyes.
Norv hasn’t found a way to win….except for winning those division titles and those playoff games.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 20, 2010 11:18 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
C'mon John
I understand you approve of Norv, thats fine. He can win division titles all day long. San Diego has been looking for a Super Bowl win for a long time now, we’ve come so close so many times. I know myself and a ton of people who don’t want to settle for division titles. If he doesn’t get us a SB then it will be a waste of years in my book. I’ll be the first person to be on these boards saying I was wrong if he gets us there. I know it’s being critical, I’m so sick of being so close and yet so far. I feel we’ve got the talent, teams have done it with less. It’s Norv’s job to put it all together and get it to work. So far, he hasn’t done that.
I wonder if Andy Reid, Ken Whisenhunt, John Fox and John Harbaugh would be looked at in the same light.
I still maintain that 1) The biggest factor in winning the Super Bowl is luck in the playoffs and 2) Outside of the Jets game, Norv’s playoff losses as Head Coach of the Chargers (to the 16-0 Patriots, to the eventual Champion Steelers) had more to do with luck and injuries (LT missing both games, Rivers playing on one leg vs. NE, etc.) than whether or not Norv “got it done”.
Bill Cowher helped the Steelers win their division 9 times and got them to the playoffs 10 times (in 15 season). It was in that 10th trip that he finally won the Super Bowl, because that was the year that injuries and luck went Pittsburgh’s way.
Andy Reid has taken the Eagles to the playoffs 8 times and won the division 6 times in 11 seasons. He is largely considered one of the league’s finest head coaches, yet he has not won a Super Bowl.
If your way of rating coaches is “He hasn’t won a Super Bowl in his first three seasons”, I don’t think there’s a coach that would ever make you happy.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 21, 2010 5:47 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I honestly hope you’re right on. This isn’t the kind of thing I want to be right about. We have wildly different perspectives on this and yours is just much more positive. I respect that and really wish I could see it the same way.
Nothing stated above is opinion.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 21, 2010 11:36 AM PST up reply actions
“I still maintain that 1) The biggest factor in winning the Super Bowl is luck in the playoffs and 2) Outside of the Jets game, Norv’s playoff losses as Head Coach of the Chargers (to the 16-0 Patriots, to the eventual Champion Steelers) had more to do with luck and injuries (LT missing both games, Rivers playing on one leg vs. NE, etc.) than whether or not Norv "got it done".”
That is all an opinion. You feel VERY strongly that the biggest factor in winning the SB is luck. I don’t agree. However, I think luck is a very big part of it. More importantly in my eyes, is a HC’s ability to instill discipline and mental toughness into his players, that’s where I think he is lacking. Look, this is all your opinion and my opinion, all that matters at the end of the day is the SB will, anything less is second best.
I backed off and didn’t want to argue it with you since it’s clear you feel very strongly about this, I get it, I get your POV. I just disagree with it. I feel like you’re telling me I’m an idiot for disagreeing with you, that isn’t right. Don’t take it so personally bud! :)
by ArksnBolts on Feb 21, 2010 5:09 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
but still
he has had a pretty good team. And while he has lost the playoff games he should have (due to injury and luck) he also lost a game this year when the stars really did seem aligned. I think super bowl caliber HCs strike while the iron is hot and Norv and the Chargers didn;t this year, and the iron was as hot as it has been in many years.
That said, it’s early, and I think Norv might still win a SB here, but I do agree with ArksnBolts in that Norv still has to prove himself. none the less, I approve of his work thus far.
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Feb 21, 2010 11:22 AM PST up reply actions
1 game does not a career make.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 21, 2010 11:36 AM PST up reply actions
so you're ready to put Norv in the Charger's hall of fame?
(Straw man argument… I know :-) )
or does he still have more to prove? I think the jury is still out, although I lean towards Norv eventually proving everything he needs to. All I’m saying is that I’m not entirely satisfied with his performance. If we had beaten the jets I think I would have been much more satisfied with his performance. None the less, I still approve of his work so far.
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Feb 21, 2010 7:00 PM PST up reply actions
Kindof
If he wins the division 70% of the time or more during his tenure as head coach, he deserves to be looked at as the most successful head coach in team history. It’s not as if we’re the Steelers or Cowboys, with a long history of championships.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 22, 2010 2:26 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
luck IS a factor
but, sometimes you make your own luck. I think if healthy against the pats a couple years ago, we win. We almost beat them as it was. But, last years game against the steelers, they had Ben punt. The saints on-side kicked to start the second half. Norv on-side kicked when he probably should have kicked it deep and hoped the defense could force them to punt. Teams take fewer chances in their own end of the field than they do at mid field. Granted, had it worked he would have been given kudos. IMO, we need an offensive coordinator that “mixes it up”. Norv is just too predictable.
if i was
the coach of sd i wouild had won 3 S B in 4 y 06 07 09
okay i have cerebral palsy arthris and chronic fatigue as well i have a great life and loveing folks some days are better than other days i got a make-a-wish in 2001 and saw my favorite team the broncos it was the trip of a lifetime i wish everyone couild have gotten to enjoy that with me i know some of u hate the broncos and that okay but i bleed organ and bule for my mnr fans but i bleed orange and blue denver will rise again resident broncos fan for every blog resident broncos for stampede bule thanks shvd98z24
Why did they resign him to 3 more years?
Norv sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
by iliketowinallthetime on Feb 20, 2010 7:14 PM PST reply actions
Mountain West Connection ::Above the Rest::
Bolts From The Blue "There’s a gleam men. Let’s go get the gleam! Focus and Finish!!! One play at a time!!! Let's Go!!!"
it kind of reminds me of that movie "You've got mail"...I'm Tom Hanks he's Meg Ryan -- Padres prospect Matt Antonelli on sdsuaztec4
by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Feb 21, 2010 7:25 AM PST up reply actions
Norv Turner
The problem(s) I have with Norv Turner is he fact the man can not get this team ready to play the big games,I know the same can be said about Marty,well that says something about the person who picks coaches!.
I read the stats on Mr Turner,sorry not good enough!this team has the talent to go all the way,but the lack of leadership and coaching,I see no emotion from this man,its like what ever this team does or dosen’t do is ok,I really have to disagree,I mean you don’t have to be a rah rah person,but you have to show that you are pleased or displeased with the teams output.
This club has a problem with to many ME players,this is where Mr Turner fails,this s a TEAM not a group of ME players who are more concerned about getting there face on TV then getting the ball in the end zone!.
I have been a loyal fan of this team for at least 30 yrs,and to say im disapointed in this team is a understatement,this season I really thought it was going to happen,but again same ole thing,do really great in regular season play and drop the ball in the playoffs,this team has a history of this,every team in the NFL knows it,and this falls back on the head coach,simple as that,the play calling against the JETS was sad,the same ole consertive play that cost them the game,this team WAS not ready to play!,falls back on Mr Turner.
When I heard they gave him 3 more yrs I couldn’t beilive it,so I guess its going to bethe same ole thing for 3 more yrs.
Well enough said,Norv Turner has got to go,as well as the ME players on this team,the way they have treated L.T. is sad,this club needs some serious work from top to bottom.
Why does the team have the talent to go all the way? Because you say so? Because ESPN predicts them to win the Super Bowl?
Think about this: A big part of the reason the Chargers are always picked as Super Bowl contenders is because Shawne Merriman is one of the most fearsome pass-rushers in the league when healthy. In Norv’s 3 playoff appearance with the Chargers he’s had an unhealthy Merriman twice and no Merriman at all once.
The problem(s) I have with Norv Turner is he fact the man can not get this team ready to play the big games
Beating the Colts in the playoffs twice and being undefeated in the month of December makes your point foolish.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 21, 2010 11:40 AM PST up reply actions
I give him a B.
He has succeeded in not embarrassing himself, and he’s kept us in the hunt consistently despite some truly awful luck. But we haven’t been to the big one, despite having one of the better teams.
Turner’s past means nothing. Washington was a long time ago, and was a wash anyway. Oakland doesn’t count. He’s met our expectations here, but not our aspirations. That’s what counts.
What is best in life? To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders!
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Feb 21, 2010 11:26 AM PST reply actions 1 recs
He’s met our expectations here, but not our aspirations.
I like that. And from the perspective of somebody who is not a “fan” (writers, front office, etc.), that means he’s been a success. Meeting expectations should be rewarded, not punished.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 21, 2010 11:41 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah, B is a passing grade.
What is best in life? To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders!
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Feb 22, 2010 8:16 AM PST up reply actions
Nothing to do with Norv
but where I work, meeting expectations is acceptable and exceeding expectations is rewarded.
He wasn’t exactly rewarded. He was allowed to keep his job.
"When they come for me I'll be sitting at my desk, with a gun in my hand wearing a bullet-proof vest, singing 'My, my, my, how the time does fly when you know you're going to die by the end of the night.'" - Catch 22
by John Gennaro on Feb 23, 2010 9:34 AM PST up reply actions
Overall...C
Things had been going downhill in the playoffs for this team since Norv took over…First year, 2 wins in the playoffs (made the AFC Championship). Second year, 1 win (made the 2nd round). Third year, zero win (lost in the 2nd round after bye). This looks to me that the team’s preparation for the big games had been deteriorating considerably every year. Granted he has won three AFC West championships in a row, one was due to luck because of Denver’s collapse, success is not measured in the regular season, but winning the big one (or maybe even just making it there for this matter).
The talent level of this team will definitely take a hit next season and this is when the “REAL” measurement of his ability to take this team in playoffs count because most of the players during the last year Marty coached will be gone. This past year was the team’s best chance to win it all since 2006 (healthy starters and playmakers with an 11 game winning streak for crying out loud!) and they lost to the Jets. I can only blame the lost to two people…Nate Kaeding of course for MISSING THREE field goals and Norv for not motivating this team enough to play well even if they are only playing the weaker Jets team that should not even have it to the playoffs.
The season after this next one, in 2011, is when the talent level will take the hit.
What is best in life? To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders!
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Feb 22, 2010 8:17 AM PST up reply actions
No more excuses
The game vs NYJets should never have come down to Kaeding. Instead of FG’s there should have been TD’s. The past few years have been pure frustration.
Good Lord, man, the Chargers have only been to one SB ever. The days of Fouts, Winslow, Joiner, Brooks, Kelcher were exciting, but no SB’s. Denver with only Elway got to three in the 1980’s. They lost them, but they got there and the fricken Raiders have rings. Hell even the Chiefs have one, but none in SD.
Red Miller took a terrible Denver team to a SB in 1977. How?
What I am wondering through this diatribe is how can SD ever do it? How can SD get to the big game? How can Brees lead NO to a SB win and yet SD have the superior team? Good Lord this is frustrating.
Make those miracles happen - Jon Keyworth
My problem with norv is
He is too easy to game plan against. Gee, you think the jets were ready for those screen passes? Every year in the pre-season we hear "don’t worry, we’re running our “vanilla” offense/defense." But, when the season starts, we see the same “vanilla” play calls. Where norv gets the “offensive genius” label from I’ll never know. Don Coryell, Ernie Zampese, they were offensive geniuses, not norv.(IMO) They had one week to work on plays that could be used against anyone and one week to plan for the jets. What did we see? The same plays they ran all year. Nothing new, nothing “imaginative”. Granted, the players “choked” making stupid mistakes and NOT executing, but the jets were clearly ready for what we ran. The defense held the jets in the first half, but we only scored 7 points. I had a bad feeling we were going to lose at halftime. I didn’t think 7 points would be enough. Where was the “wild frog”? where was the LT pass to a receiver? Something the jets hadn’t seen us run a hundred times durring the regular season. Again, JMO.
Are you serious?
Of all the things you choose to criticse Norv of, it’s his offensive play calling ability?
How exactly is this offense vanilla? That jsut seems entirely contrary to how it actually runs with long-developing passing plays with high risk throws. Sure, it’s executed well because of the very good players, but bad play calling inevitably does not work with that kind of consistency.
How has Norv earned his “offensive genius” label? Calling the plays for a back-to-back Superbowl winning team and developing QB after QB has something to do with it. San Diego scored the 4th most points in the league in 2009, 2nd msot in 2008. I think his offense works pretty well.
About the Jets… That was a very good defense run by one of the top defensive minds of the last decade. I’d like to see us successfully executing our bread and butter before we start running trick plays that could blow up massively in our faces. Thsoe kind of plays are run as calculated risks and during msot of the Jets game, those numbers weren’t adding up.
by gman87 on Feb 22, 2010 2:35 AM PST up reply actions 4 recs
Rec.
Good response to the same exact bit of generally (and specifically!) unwarranted criticism that every team gets to put up with for seven months after a January choke.
What is best in life? To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders!
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Feb 22, 2010 8:20 AM PST up reply actions
the colts beat them
So, I guess your saying the colts are better than the chargers? The colts beat that very good defense of the jets. The few times I saw the chargers run their “wild frog”, it worked every single time. And, against a blitzing defense, you throw quick slants, not long developing deep bombs. That’s al Davis philosophy, throw deep. I’d also like to see more man coverage. With no pass rush almost any qb can pick apart a soft zone defense. How many third and 15 yards plus did other teams convert this year? and, if memory serves me correctly, the steelers converted a third and 19 and a third and 21 last year in the playoffs. To me, that is just un-acceptable. But, I guess some people are satisfied winning the division only to lose in the playoffs. And, remember denver was 8-8. Not exactly a tough division to win.
No one is satisfied with winning the division only to lose in the playoffs
But 7 or 8 division winners do it every year. It’s holding any individual to too high of a standard if you are calling them a failure for only being above average.
There is no way that NFL coaches look at the Chargers and say, “Man is this team easy to game plan against!”
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
by Wonko on Feb 22, 2010 11:00 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
January is the month he has issues, not regular season
Yes the team had put up big numbers in the regular season and the Jets maybe one of the best defenses out there. But look at what this team has done against some of the good defenses all year long and to come up this short at their home turf in January can only be classified as choke.
Just in this game alone, many of the “bread and butter” plays hardly worked. Jets pass defense is one of the best in the league and the plays called were still mostly pass plays. There are two good RBs in this team that are capable of making big plays. LT can easily have run a few wildcat plays that Miami used to kill the Jets twice last year.
Greater than a super majority approves.
I am pleasantly surprised.
Mountain West Connection ::Above the Rest::
Bolts From The Blue "There’s a gleam men. Let’s go get the gleam! Focus and Finish!!! One play at a time!!! Let's Go!!!"
it kind of reminds me of that movie "You've got mail"...I'm Tom Hanks he's Meg Ryan -- Padres prospect Matt Antonelli on sdsuaztec4
by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Feb 22, 2010 11:31 AM PST reply actions
I think it'd be really hard
For a fanbase to give a coach a bad approval rating after making the playoffs (especially after doing it every year he’s been the HC) even if the fanbase has their doubts about the guy.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
This is where I am.
Pass/Fail? Pass.
Thrilled? No.
What is best in life? To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders!
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Feb 22, 2010 1:09 PM PST up reply actions
I'm actually pretty close to "Thrilled"
These last 3 years are more than I could have expected out of Norv when the Chargers hired him.
I’m just not willing to be the type of person that expects Super Bowl wins. Or treats 13-3 or 11-5 seasons or 3 playoff wins like they grow on trees. This is hard work that he’s done for us.
I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.
Bolts from the Blue - General Manager: It is what it isn't
by Wonko on Feb 22, 2010 2:35 PM PST up reply actions 2 recs
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