Clever Chargers-Related Title: 12/28 Chargers Links

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 11:07 AM PST in San Diego Chargers Daily Links

LT: Appreciating A Decade Of Dominance - Craig Elsten - 619 Sports
At some point, hopefully in Miami but perhaps somewhere else, the 2009 Chargers season will come to an end. When it does, LaDainian Tomlinson will take off his Chargers uniform, likely for the last time. Looking back at a decade of greatness from the all-time greatest Charger.

Bolts playing so well it’s downright scary - Tim Sullivan - SignOnSanDiego.com
This is what scary good looks like. "Kevered," was the word Tennessee tackle Tony Brown used to describe the Chargers’ 42-17 trampling of the Titans last night at LP Field. "The word ‘kevered’ means we got run amok, outplayed, anything you want it to be," Brown explained.

Acee Analysis: Chargers vs. Titans
Kevin Acee's must-watch weekly breakdown of the past week's game.

Chargers may be best NFL team; Colts fans irate; more Week 16 - Peter King - SI.com
Well, at least Peter King is giving the Chargers the kind of respect a lot of San Diego fans have been clamoring for of late.

Football Outsiders is Committed to Crapping on Norv Turner
Doug Farrar: [Matt Millen] said his usual amount of preposterous crap, though he spent this last week coming up with new stuff. My personal favorites tonight were his praise of San Diego's offensive line as one of the five best in the NFL (25th in ALY, dead last in Power and Second-Level Yards; both LDT and Darren Sproles averaged 3.3 yards per carry coming into this game) and his insistence that Norv Turner is one of the best play-callers in the NFL.

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Any thoughts on an actually clever Chargers-related title for this daily link dump?

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 11:08 AM PST reply actions

Since I laughed out loud

My vote is to keep it this way.

Also, if Farrar is going to start questioning Norv’s offensive playcalling he’s going to find himself all alone. I’d say that Norv must’ve done something to the FO guys at some point to make them hate him so much, but he’s generally regarded as the nicest coach in the league.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 11:10 AM PST up reply actions

I’ve used this “joke” before in 2005 at Beyond the Box Score.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions

I kind of understood Doug's point

I think he was trying to say that Norv doesn’t necessarily call the right plays for the right situations, but the plays he has at his disposal are really well designed. So he ends up with an effective offense because of his play designs. I’m not sure what evidence he has with the more recent Norv teams about the playcalling (although, the back of my mind screams of internet rants about “LT/Sproles up the middle again?!?!?”), but I know that there were issues going back to his Washington days about some questionable playcalling.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 11:25 AM PST up reply actions

1. Farrar seems to be rating the Chargers offensive line purely on the rushing game. It’s silly to do that and even bit a silly of him to criticize the line (which was starting Hardwick and Dombrowski) by showing what it had done previously in the season.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 11:31 AM PST up reply actions

I really don't want to belabor that point

Since that seemed more like Millen-bashing than Charger-bashing. And I am in favor of Millen-bashing. He just happening to be reaching for a way to bash Millen on that one.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 11:35 AM PST up reply actions

He seemed happy to be knocking out two birds with one stone. Bashing Millen for praising Norv.

To me, it would’ve been smarter if he would’ve criticized Millen for saying something that’s generally known by most football fans (Norv’s play-calling has been successful for decades and is generally revered as “great”).

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 11:36 AM PST up reply actions

Fine, I'll belabor it

Basically, Farrar is just trying to say the the San Diego OLine isn’t, as Millen put it, one of the best in the NFL. Now, I guess if you wanted to get really critical of that assertion you could claim that “best in the NFL” could refer to the top half of the NFL, but let’s just assume he means top 5 or so. Farrar’s point about the problems running the ball in a variety of eras would point to the line not being one of the best. Injuries would also point to that as well. So, I still think that Farrar wasn’t really overstepping his bounds criticizing the Chargers OLine and was basically going after Millen (albeit on a fairly benign comment that used a superlative that many announcers also use), however he should have at least put in a caveat about their passing success, but that’s a lot to expect from a quick email response.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 11:46 AM PST up reply actions

I've never been a fan

of their “adjusted line yards” stat, or their stats that purport to tell which linemen are responsible for which sacks. I think that blocking on rushing plays and pass-protection are too detailed and intricate to be able to just have a computer read a play-by-play and get a real picture of what happened.

For example, a particular run goes “off right tackle” for 0 yards. So that would go down in their system as a failure for the right tackle, but if you actually watch the play it could be the fullback missed a block, or the pulling left guard didn’t get over quick enough to get the kick-out block.

For pass-protection, the same thing. I’m reminded of a sack Rivers took Week 1 vs. Oakland. Richard Seymour was the lineman who actually physically took Rivers down and got credit for the sack, but the reason wasn’t because he beat Marcus McNeill, it was because on the other side Greg Ellis pushed Clary into the pocket, preventing Philip from stepping up. In the system, that goes down as a negative for McNeill, because technically it was his man who got the sack, but it was really Clary and Ellis who were responsible for it.

"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds

by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 28, 2009 11:37 AM PST up reply actions

I agree

It’s a mildly entertaining stat, but not an extremely enlightening one. I think Farrar overstepped his bounds trying to stretch that stat into a meaningful conclusion.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 11:40 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs

2. Farrar seems to be implying that Norv is great on Monday-Saturday and his offenses fall flat on Sunday. I bet if you were to ask Doug if he finds Norv comparable to Spurrier, he would say yes. It’s that kind of ignorance that drives me nuts. How can somebody be great at QB development and a bad play-caller?

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 11:33 AM PST up reply actions

I don't think he's saying that the offenses fall flat on Sunday

If I were to try to read into more about what he said, it’s more that Norv isn’t a good situational play caller. He doesn’t do things to attack teams weaknesses. He build a bunch of very good plays and calls them when he wants to on Sunday. The team doesn’t necessarily fall flat because the plays are still good enough to succeed against even the best defenses, plus the players he has execute at such a high level to help them succeed.

I’m not sure that’s not an unfair point. Not that I give credit to Doug Farrar credit for making it, since it’s more my interpretation than his actual words. I think it’s actually worth discussing though.

Does Norv ever make play calls that are situation-based or does he just gameplan based on his best play designs?

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 11:52 AM PST up reply actions

I think he’s an excellent situational play-caller. I base this off the fact that I do see the Chargers attacking teams’ weaknesses (going to Gates when they have weak LBs and Safeties, going deep when the CBs are prone to bite on a play-fake, etc.).

Outside of the fact that he occasionally outhinks himself on 3rd down (thinking that they opposing team will never see the draw to Sproles coming), I don’t see any issue with his situational play-calling. I think it says something that the team is able to put up points so consistently. At this point the offense is nearly identical to Dallas and the level of talent is as well, but yet the Cowboys are so terribly inconsistent with it and my theory is it’s because Garrett isn’t half the play-caller that Norv is and ends up abandoning the run way too early far too often.

Just my opinion, though.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:16 PM PST up reply actions

I don't know about

The Gates vs weak LBs and Safeties. I think there have been games this year where we were facing weak LBs and Ss and they just kept calling bombs to VJ and M80 against good corners. I have my doubts about how well Norv evaluates other teams strengths and weakness and how to attack them.

Maybe that’s why he gets criticism for not doing well with mediocre or average teams. Maybe there is a minimum skill level to pull his stuff off since he’s trying to design plays that will beat anyone instead of trying to expose weaknesses through matchups. This strategy could also explain the flatness or some of his teams since there would be little margin for error at times. You could be playing a team like the Raiders and keeping throwing your well designed bombs only to have Asomugha playing his ass off knocking stuff down, when you could have easily abused the other corner or the LBs by sending stuff their way. And, if you have a few dumb penalties or sloppy D on top of that, things could get out of hand. On the other side of the coin, if your team was disciplined and your defense stout, your offense could excel against one of the best defenses in the NFL or have the firepower to hold your own in a shootout.

I don’t know. I’m just thinking outside the box. Maybe I’m making too much sense.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions

I hear what you’re saying and it’s a valid point. However, the Raiders LBs and Safeties are nearly as good as Asomugha. In those game, Oakland was getting plenty of pressure with 4 guys which means they were able to double Gates. And it’s not like Chambers was much help at that point. I know it’s just one example, but for the most part I think VJ’s “down” part of the season had a lot to do with who we were facing and what their defensive strengths were (and Norv play-calling around that). I could just be a big Norv fan though.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:40 PM PST up reply actions

The Raiders were means to showing what I meant

I wasn’t necessarily using a specific example of a game this season. If I were, it would be a game more like the Cowboys where we spent the first half testing Mike Jenkins even though all the Cowboys fans were telling us that he’s great and should be avoided.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:46 PM PST up reply actions

Norv's play-calling is evolving - and in a good way

Not trying to be overly diplomatic, but I think you guys (John and Wonko) are both right: Norv designs his gameplan quite well (and is getting better at it), and while he used to stick more stubbornly to it, now he’s developing more of an ability to play-call situationally….

What do I know, for sure? — But this is what it looks like to me…. Maybe he’s been learning more about the game himself (even after all these years in the NFL), or maybe he’s knowing his personnel better — now that he’s in his third year with the team (and with a lot of the same players), or maybe he’s working better with his coaching staff…. I’d hypothesize that it’s some of all three.

Plus, even though Hardwick’s now back (thank goodness, esp. since Mooch went down), I think the “Ski” boys were getting better, and Norv was getting more comfortable with them…. Not to mention Gates is his stud self again, VJ, Malcolm, Legedu, and even Rivers are all just getting better and better…. Tolbert and Hester, too…. When you’ve got that amount of talent, they’re all working hard and getting better, it makes play-calling better — and easier….(!)…. And that’s to take nothing away from Norv: it’s all to his credit, and everyone’s….. This is the synergy we’ve got, that we’re enjoying, and that we want to continue.

by jctess on Dec 29, 2009 2:07 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs

I think

This is right on

by shaaners on Dec 28, 2009 1:40 PM PST up reply actions

3. As much as many of us hated those runs for no yards early in the season, we loved just as much the huge pass plays off of play-action that they created. Emotionally-invested fans mid-game are hardly level-minded critics of play-calling prowess.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 11:34 AM PST up reply actions

They hate them some Norv Turner.

"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds

by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 28, 2009 11:30 AM PST up reply actions

I think what’s really impressive is that on a day where the Chargers played in and decisively won the only game that there wasn’t one complimentary statement about them in Audibles.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 12:02 PM PST up reply actions

Yup.

I looked back at some of their audibles from past seasons, like when we beat the Colts in the playoffs these last two years.

Mostly about the Colts making mistakes and fluky plays going against them rather than the Chargers actually playing well and winning.

"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds

by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 28, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions

I didn't find that surprising

I think a lot of people tuned into that game to see the Chris Johnson run wild and continue their potentially miraculous run at a wild card spot.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:05 PM PST up reply actions

Also, the SB Nation Clipper is the greatest thing ever.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 11:24 AM PST reply actions

I assumed that there must be some tool for doing posts like this

Since jbox has become so consistent with it on GLB.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 11:26 AM PST up reply actions

Told you. I bet this post took you all of 5 minutes.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 11:29 AM PST up reply actions

If that.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 11:33 AM PST up reply actions

yup

Mountain West Connection ::Above the Rest::
Bolts From The Blue "There’s a gleam men. Let’s go get the gleam! Focus and Finish!!! One play at a time!!! Let's Go!!!"
Representing the San Diego State University Aztecs, home of the 2009 College Cheerleading National Champions in the all women's division.

by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Dec 28, 2009 11:57 PM PST up reply actions

Only Built for Charger Linx

by Rocket Surgery on Dec 28, 2009 11:47 AM PST reply actions

Idea

I’ve long thought we needed a feature titled “Show Me Your Lightning Bolt.” Perhaps that would work for this.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 11:50 AM PST reply actions

Reach for the pun, mebbe?

Show me your linking bolt!

Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you? ◔ヮ◔
Uncommon Sportsman :: Absurdity in play

by Axion on Dec 28, 2009 11:51 AM PST up reply actions

I hate puns.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 12:02 PM PST up reply actions

First person to come up with a Chargers pun/title that makes Richard laugh wins

LaDainian Tomlinkson
Keith Linkoln
Link Alworth
Kellen Winslink

I think the LaDainian one is my favorite. We could refer to the post as BFTB’s LDTL.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:24 PM PST up reply actions

Serious Business with Richard Wade

“Shut up, it’s not funny.”

Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you? ◔ヮ◔
Uncommon Sportsman :: Absurdity in play

by Axion on Dec 28, 2009 12:38 PM PST up reply actions

I like it

I also like the idea of “I Hate Mondays”, “I Hate Tuesdays”, etc. depending on the day. Not Chargers-related though.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:41 PM PST up reply actions

Or "I Don't Like Mondays"

Referencing the Boomtown Rats song… which probably none of you remember.

GET OFF MY LAWN, YA KIDS!

by Nohm on Dec 28, 2009 12:42 PM PST up reply actions

Thanks a lot

Now I’m going to be humming THAT song all night.

by Back2SD2006 on Dec 28, 2009 4:29 PM PST up reply actions

I think I just died a little inside from reading those.

Bolts from the Blue // "I have got to be the most boring GM in the league." - A.J. Smith
Bloody Elbow // " looks like your comment violated rule #4. and it’s a heck of a rule, rule #4" - Kid Nate

by Richard Wade on Dec 28, 2009 12:52 PM PST up reply actions

Poway!

Oceanside!

Light up these lines!

"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds

by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 28, 2009 12:04 PM PST up reply actions

Alpine! Encinitas!

Where are you?

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:06 PM PST up reply actions

RANCHO CUCAMONGA!!!

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:18 PM PST up reply actions

For as much as I dislike his show, I’m going to miss Hacksaw when he’s gone.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:18 PM PST up reply actions

One thing I will say for him

is that he’s better than the Bleacher Bums.

"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds

by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 28, 2009 12:19 PM PST up reply actions

Now that he's back on the air

I like him better than I remembered him from before. Maybe he’s humbled? He seems to do a better job of listening and asking questions to his interviews/callers instead of forcing his own opinions at them and then getting frustrated when they don’t agree. He’ll hear them out and then wait until they hang up to say why they are wrong.

As with all drivetime radio shows, the following caveat for me has to be made, I like listening to the talk radio shows because I find it better for my psyche to get angry at them then at the other idiot drivers in rush hour. If my mind is racing thinking about how dumb the DJ is for thinking that LT has another 1200 yard season in him, then I’m less likely to care that some jackass just passed everyone on the shoulder so that he could get home 2 minutes earlier.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:24 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs

Good caveat

Also, you just convinced me to listen to Hacksaw again. I stopped listening to him 3 years ago because he was so awful at listening to others and thinking about the points they were making.

"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock

by John Gennaro on Dec 28, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions

Not really a big hacksaw guy

Listening to his show is like having ADD

by AirNorval on Dec 28, 2009 12:26 PM PST up reply actions

That is true.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:34 PM PST up reply actions

It's funny when he's got 5 topics to discuss

when callers only call in with one comment. Then he drags them along through the rest of the stuff they don’t care about.

Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you? ◔ヮ◔
Uncommon Sportsman :: Absurdity in play

by Axion on Dec 28, 2009 12:35 PM PST up reply actions

And then makes fun of them

For being football fans who don’t care about Tiger Woods.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:36 PM PST up reply actions

HAHAHA

I heard three people rip him for wasting time talking about TIger Woods

by AirNorval on Dec 28, 2009 12:44 PM PST up reply actions

You didn't listen very long

He loves it. I didn’t care about Tiger even when he was still a golfer.

Isn't it enough to know that I ruined a pony making a gift for you? ◔ヮ◔
Uncommon Sportsman :: Absurdity in play

by Axion on Dec 28, 2009 12:46 PM PST up reply actions

Same here on the Tiger thing

I have yet to hear a stimulating conversation involving Tiger Woods. They all seem boring. Either it was, “He’s awesome and he’s going to win. Thoughts?” or “He hates the media, he lies to them and we will severely admonish him for any wrongdoing that has occurred even if it is highly personal. Thoughts?”

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:48 PM PST up reply actions

Yeah

I turned it off, I really could care less about a dude banging porn stars, getting beat with a golf club, and crashing a car. Yeah its funny to hear about once I guess, but I dont need it broken down like a playoff run.

by AirNorval on Dec 28, 2009 12:50 PM PST up reply actions

I don't want to hear about any of that stuff

The main reason I even care about the police blotter as it pertains to NFL players is to evaluate whether or not it will cause them to miss a game.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 28, 2009 12:53 PM PST up reply actions

M80 on 1090 now

dude is money, great interview

by AirNorval on Dec 28, 2009 12:24 PM PST reply actions

Yeah,

Millen proved to me his lack of football intelligence. I remember laughing when he praised our o-line as one of the best in football. As much as I would love this to be the case, its not.

Anatidaephobia-Fear that a Duck is watching you. Pryor, come January 1st, there will be millions watching you. We are banking on your overwhelming football prowess, blessed Juju.

by CaDuck on Dec 28, 2009 1:39 PM PST reply actions

Why trash our Offensive line?

Its easy to criticize the O-line for being bad when you lose your center and your tackle and you end up having just half your veterans for the better part of the year. Now that Hardwick is back, Runyan is learning the system, and Vasquez is maturing and learning at an NFL level, I bet our O-line will have a GREAT post season now that its much closer to 100%. They also forgot to mention that when healthy, that same O-line was ranked in the top 10 for 3 years, so I don’t see the big deal. LT and Sproles will do much better next year when everyone is back to 100%.

by Superduperboltman on Dec 29, 2009 7:02 AM PST reply actions

Wouldn't losing your Center and Tackle make a top O Line become one that isn't one of the top ones?

That kind of makes sense to me. For all the problems with what Doug Farrar was saying. I still think it’s a valid to consider the line as it has performed, not how it could have performed if everyone was healthy.

I'm the first person to admit that I'm wrong about a lot of things, but I'm going to be the last person to admit I'm wrong about what we're currently talking about.

by Wonko on Dec 29, 2009 10:35 AM PST up reply actions

FO may have been trashing our OL unfairly by implication

But Farrar didn’t say anything except to question Millen’s use of superlatives. I think that’s quite reasonable: I’d imagine from what I’ve seen that if an objective pro were to rank the OLs in this league, SD would be somewhere in the #10-15 range. They aren’t very good at run-blocking, but they’ve adapted remarkably well to major disruptions and have helped the P.R. Machine look so good. His criticism of Turner is totally uncalled-for, OTOH.

What is best in life? To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the cheerleaders!

by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Dec 29, 2009 12:29 PM PST up reply actions