Norv vs. Jerry Jones. Their History Should Make For Good Football.
by shaaners on Dec 10, 2009 9:56 AM PST
42 comments
picture credit: i.tsn.com
Ed Werder, writing for ESPN Dallas, illuminates the history between Norv and Jerry Jones. As Offensive Coordinator, Norv won them storied 'Boys of '92 & '93, two superbowls and was passed up for the head coaching job, twice. Once to Chan Gailey (who?) and again to Wade Phillips. From the article:
According to people who know him, Turner will possess an enormous urge to demonstrate that he's a better head coach than Phillips, that he's a better offensive game planner and playcaller than Jason Garrett, and that he has developed Philip Rivers into a quarterback who can statistically outperform Tony Romo and win on the Cowboys' field when it really matters.
What a feather in Norv's cap, to beat Jones' team in that shiny new stadium. Anyway, great article, check it out:
Full article here.
This FanPost was written by a member of the Bolts From The Blue community and does not necessarily reflect the views of the Bolts From The Blue editors or SB Nation.
0 recs |
42 comments
|
Email
Print
Comments
Not buying it.
At this point, Werder’s job is to be Jerry Jones’ moutpiece and also drum up a storyline before every Cowboys game to generate more interest.
As I said over at BTB, this sitaution is ten times better for Turner (who’s a low-key guy that probably wouldn’t have wanted to let Jason Garrett call the plays) and I’m sure he knows it. He was passed over for the Cowboys job before the Chargers job was even available, so you can’t even make the argument that he went after one harder than the other.
I’m sure if the Chargers destroy the Cowboys Norv will be happy to be seen as the “better coach”, amongst Cowboy and Charger fans alike. However, I do not think he’s coming into the game with some vendetta against the Dallas organization or it’s owner.
"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock
And besides
Norv just doesn’t strike me a vendetta type of guy. His first head coaching job was for a Cowboys rival. He strikes me as a guy that just wants to coach and doesn’t care who its for.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
It would be interesting to peek into the parallel universe
where Norv got the head coaching job at Dallas instead of Wade.
Then Wade stays in SD, Shotty nevery tries to hire his brother and never pisses Spanos off enough to let AJ fire him. We go 14-2 every year since then and lose our first playoff game every year. All of us Bolt fans age in dog years and become hopeless alchoholics trying to salve our pain.
Meanwhile, Norv turns Romo into Rivers, and D Ware hooks up with Tila Tequila…
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Dec 10, 2009 11:13 AM PST up reply actions
Uhhh, wow.
If ever there was a reason to become an alcoholic, I imagine it would not top this
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
Well
On the whole I agree, but I do remember Norv tossing a challenge leading 37-7 against the Raiders last year with less than two minutes to play. I suspect he does harbor a certain resentment against old Al.
"Football is a physical sport, sometimes you have a disagreement on what's going on, and you have a discussion about it." Kris Dielman
by Brian (DaBolts) on Dec 10, 2009 1:14 PM PST up reply actions
Whoah, whoah, whoah fellas
“Feather in his cap” is a lot different than vendetta. One could even say that, “Norv will be happy to be seen as the "better coach", amongst Cowboy and Charger fans alike.” Is kinda the same as a feather in his cap.
Norv’s even keel aside, the man isn’t the Buddha, and I’m sure a win in Jerry’s house is likely to be tastier than most. Is it as tasty as a win in the playoffs? I’m saying the history between the two will make for some better ball, is all. And the article does a great job of detailing the history.
Yeah, its skewed. The “According to people who know him” clause that begins the graph I posted is basically a long-winded version of “They.” Which means its made up. But its ESPN Dallas. Of course they’re gonna heighten the stakes and drum up a storyline. And no disrespect to BFTB, I love this site, and you guys are hardly a mouthpiece, but isn’t calling Ed Werder out for ‘generating more interest’ a little bit of the pot calling the kettle black? I mean, what is it you guys, or any sports media outlet; new or old, do other than generate interest?
The feather in the cap statement was fine. It was this one by Werder that seemed outlandish.
Turner will possess an enormous urge to demonstrate that he’s a better head coach than Phillips.
First off, every head coach wants to prove he’s better than the guy on the opposite sideline every single week. Second, I don’t get any sort of “enormous urge” from Norv to make Jerry feel like he made a mistake.
Also, what I was saying is that Werder (and ESPN) attempts to generate interest in a game with gossip and storylines that don’t exist. Whereas, here at BFTB, we’re more interested in generating interest in things like the matchup of the Chargers run D against the Cowboys three-headed RBs.
I appreciate where you’re coming from, I just think Werder is being dumb.
"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock
by John Gennaro on Dec 10, 2009 12:22 PM PST up reply actions
I feel pretty certain
that Norv just wants to get the win. Since the Merriman v Ware story isn’t going anywhere, this idiot has to back up & try another angle.
If the thunder don't get ya then the lightning will!!
Robert Hunter
Re: being dumb
I agree.
His last name is Werder. And he’s a writer. Its not even ironic, its just embarrassing for him.
You’re right. Werder’s piece is sensationalism dressed up in facts. You guys do a great job avoiding that. Keep it up!
Thanks
I really think Norv would’ve been hired over Wade in Dallas, but Garrett was already hired to be the OC and I doubt Norv was cool with that.
"I did not invent the wheel, I was the crooked spoke adjacent." - Aesop Rock
by John Gennaro on Dec 10, 2009 12:43 PM PST up reply actions
My Dead Horse.
Sorry to beleaguer, but this was just posted by Matt Mosley on ESPN’s NFL Nation Blog. Titled, “Cowboys Shouldn’t Have Passed On Norv.”
http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/13680/cowboys-shouldnt-have-passed-on-norv
It breaks down the history even better than the last article, but still finds a way to weave a heightened sense of ‘drama’ into Sunday’s game.
Either way, I can’t wait. Ees going to be a good one.
Don't let the people at Football Outsiders read that
They might have an aneurysm.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
do the FO guys have a stat for coaching?
Seems like they should be able to come up with a number that reflects how well a team actually did compared to how well their stats said that team should do. maybe there are too many uncontrolled variables in something like that.
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Dec 10, 2009 2:00 PM PST up reply actions
They have an irrational bias against Turner.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 10, 2009 2:04 PM PST up reply actions
I would say they have a rational bias
taken to an irrational extreme… After all, Norv is still 10+ games under .500 for his career. But I think they fail to see that he has been at least above average his three years with the Chargers. I think part of their problem with Norv is that the FO stats always say the Chargers should do better than they end up doing, so the FO guys blame Norv.
sounds like confirmation bias to me. :-)
by Stephen (shaynes41) on Dec 10, 2009 2:43 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think any of their problem with Norn is from how the Chargers perform
They wrote their anti-Norv article in the offseason where he took over as coach. Basically, they have used the conclusions in that article define their “definition” of what Norv is and they have not allowed anything he has done with the Chargers change that “definition”. It is one of their (and by “their” I mainly mean Mike Tanier, Aaron Schatz and Bill Barnwell; perhaps Doug Farra) most irrational viewpoints, which is odd because they are mostly a rational bunch.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
by Wonko on Dec 10, 2009 3:16 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
There are lots of people out there
who I think would swear Turner is terrible if he won three Super Bowls in a row.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 10, 2009 3:20 PM PST up reply actions
I saw a statistic...
…a few weeks back, maybe it was here. That Norv is now, % wise, the winningest coach in Chargers’ history. That’s kindof awesome. FOutsiders probably missed that one.
It took me a while, I think its taken all of us a while, but the guy’s really grown on me.
And I’m not just saying that because we’re winning.
I think what we’ve seen with all those awkward games, close games, and missteps from last year and this year is the transformation from Martyball to AirNorval. Things were too messy with the Defensive changeups early in the season (injuries and personnel changes). But starting with the Giants game (and a healthy LT) I really noticed that the offense is not only performing, but its got a personality. A signature. Teams search and search for an identity. . We’ve got one, again. And it only took us two seasons. Two winning seasons. Some teams spend years looking for one. That’s a big deal.
I'm sure Football Outsiders missed that one
But it’s partially (very partially) for good reason. You can’t simply throw out what Norv did before he became the Chargers HC. You can try and explain it, but you can’t simply throw it out and say that because he’s winning now he’s automatically great.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
Let's not
Be too harsh here guys. We lost seven starters in that first oakland game. Seven!! Not stretched out over a few games, not over a season. One game. Thats retarded how unlucky that is.
Rivera had to figure out on the fly how to replace Jamal Williams without Bingham, without Cesaire, without Ian Scott. Vaughn Martin had never been in an NFL stadium before. OG was 3 months gone from hopping back and forth from practice to working at Avis or whatever. Hardwick was out, Mooch had never played center before. Vasquez was out, and he was a rookie to begin with. And then to top it all off we lost LT, too.
We stand a great chance of getting 13 wins this season. Thirteen!! The fact that we’re in the running for for 2nd place is awesome. I know all teams have to deal with injuries, but getting on Turner’s back for a slow start is unwarranted. Its like yelling at a marathon runner for finishing 2nd after getting his leg chewed off by a bear in the first mile of the race.
A few months ago people were saying 10-6, 11-5 for the team.
I was thinking our playoff run would start in Pitt or New England…
But going through Indy? We own Indy!!
I love how one overtime playoff win and one 4 pt playoff win on the road
Means we own a team.
Cleveland had lost to the Steelers for as long as the Raiders have been losing to us and they just beat them last night.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
Now can the bills beat the patriots
So we can own that record. I wouldn’t say we own the colts just were a bit more favorable match-up when Dungy was there. This colts team we can’t really judge until we play them.
The one and only AzDuck
I'd like to think
That we’ll have a better idea about the Colts when they play Broncos this weekend. But, we probably won’t.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
What do you guys think
About this whole notion of Indy ‘throwing’ the game against Denver just to rattle SD? They wont throw it, but they may do what we did in Cleveland: pull a bunch of starters and leave it i the hands of the practice squad.
OR
Will Peyton’s competition against Brees outweigh that.
OR
am I just being paranoid?
and you’re right, we don’t own Indy. Peyton hasn’t been to a superbowl in a long time, and if we make it to the AFC championship in Indy…that is going to be a tough, tough game.
They won't rest anyone until they lock up homefield advantage.
Then Manning and co. will barely play until round 2 of the playoffs.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 11, 2009 1:43 PM PST up reply actions
I think you are reading too much into this...
Even if Indy loses to Denver, I doubt it would impact the Bolts at all when we (hopefully) meet in the playoffs.
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
Indy
We also beat Indy in 2007 in the regular season and 2005 regular season when they were 13-0. I think we’re 4-1 against them in the last 5 games.
Quick
Name all the players who started for that 2005 team that start for us now. Not counting Hardwick and Williams there are 3 on offense and 3 on defense. We do have the same kickers and long snapper though. However, the HC, OC and DC are all different.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
by Wonko on Dec 15, 2009 10:32 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I can't fathom a rational reason why the Colts would do anything other than play to win.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
Until they've clinched everything.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 11, 2009 2:02 PM PST up reply actions
Even then, do you really want to rest your guys? If you’ve locked up home field and first-round bye, you already have two weeks off to rest up. Do you want to keep resting your starters for a month or keep them playing and sharp? I know Dungy rested the team once they locked things up, but you could argue that attributed to them making early exits from the playoffs since they got a little rusty sitting around.
Oh I agree.
But history suggests that’s what they’ll do.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 11, 2009 2:26 PM PST up reply actions
Do you ever not play to win the game?
Our collective lack of productivity has clearly paid off in the grandest of fashion. We are going to Pasadena. Yes, let that sink in. WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. To be honest, this has not yet hit me-WE ARE GOING TO PASADENA. Wow.
Juju, We applaud your devotion and pure decency throughout the season.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 12, 2009 6:28 PM PST up reply actions
Personally I play it just to play it.
"I aim to misbehave." - Mal Reynolds
by Zach (maestro876) on Dec 12, 2009 6:28 PM PST up reply actions
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Call or Txt: 760-515-BFTB (2382)
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
