Broncos’ Orton Will Play Despite Ankle Injury
by ArksnBolts on Nov 16, 2009 7:33 PM PST
35 comments
NFL Network insider Michael Lombardi is reporting Denver Broncos QB Kyle Orton will play this week against the San Diego Chargers despite an injured left ankle.
Orton sat out the second half of Sunday’s 27-17 loss to the Redskins after he was injured during a scramble late in the first half, and refused to speculate on the severity of the injury following the game.
Just that! I wonder in what kind of shape and how long he'll be able to stay out there. Orton in bad shape might benefit us more than the Bronco's. That being said, it's not like Simm's is great.
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Oh my...
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by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Nov 16, 2009 8:42 PM PST reply actions
Yeah yeah.
Show up expecting Orton at 100%, ok, guys? Don’t get lulled into thinking this will be an easy game, even if it looks like a crushing at halftime. Just remember what happened last time.
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Nov 17, 2009 8:53 AM PST reply actions
Seems kinda foolish
on their part. I know its a big game but there is a lot of football season left. Further injuring his ankle during this game and having to use Simms to rest of the way = ruined Donkey season. Simms was just awful.
This blog has devolved into UT like, uncerebral blabber
Historically
Quarterbacks that come in as injury replacements have below average performances. If Simms gets the reps at practice I think the Broncos offense could be something like 80-90% as effective as with Orton.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
I would think
that the Bronco’s would like to be 80-90% as effective on Sunday’s game with Simm’s rather than possibly hurt Orton and have him out for more games. I get it, I would probably want Orton to play if he was able. However, that might not be the best thing in the long run.
I don't think that you could convince many broncos fans that Simms will be 80-90% as effective.
In the second half, against the Redskins, he couldn’t do anything. Knowshon Moreno was averaging 5.5 yards per carry and Orton showed in the first half that the Redskins could be beaten on the long ball. Despite having the RB gashing holes in the redskins and the WRs getting open, Simms was 3 for 13 for 13 yards with 1 INT. That is unacceptable.
Even if Simms got reps at practice, his attitude on the sidelines doesn’t show that he even cares if he is doing poorly. He was joking and smiling on the sidelines after blowing a halftime lead.
An injured Orton would still be better than a healthy Simms IMO.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 17, 2009 3:22 PM PST up reply actions
I think you're jumping to some conclusions there
If they didn’t have confidence that Simms could fill that backup role effectively they would have found somebody better. McDaniels strikes me as a guy that is very quarterback-oriented and would be (somewhat) obsessed with making sure his guys are in place. Much like with Matt Cassel’s early struggles as a backup, I think McDaniels knows that Simms really does have the capability to run that offense effectively and that’s why he’s still around and still the #2. Just throw out that performance vs. the Redskins it’s meaningless. It has no bearing on what would happen when he’s had reps and with the coaches knowing what plays he runs effectively and which ones he doesn’t. It also doesn’t hurt that they will be playing an AFC West opponent as opposed to a less familiar NFC opponent.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
by Wonko on Nov 17, 2009 3:58 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
As nice as that sounds, I don't think you can "throw out" the performance in Washington.
Simms could be a good QB in this system, but it would take a lot of time. It took Orton about 7 weeks, including preseason, to get the hang of this offense and have a QB rating over 100 (excluding week one against the bengals where the stokely TD saved his performance). The fact of the matter is, Simms doesn’t have that long.
McDaniels isn’t going to change his playcalling based on Simms’ skillset. He said in his postgame interview that they stuck with their normal gameplan against the Redskins because Simms, at this point in the season, is expected to know how to run the offense.
Practice reps are fine, but it just isn’t the same as a real game.
Simms isn’t familiar with SD. He hasn’t played against SD in a bronco uniform.
If the broncos are to make a playoff push this year, it will have to be with Orton at QB.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 17, 2009 4:22 PM PST up reply actions
I still think you're being too pessimistic
I’m going to over-analyze your remark: “McDaniels isn’t going to change his playcalling based on Simms’ skillset. He said in his postgame interview that they stuck with their normal gameplan against the Redskins because Simms, at this point in the season, is expected to know how to run the offense.”
I disagree with the first sentence. However, the second seems obvious to me. You can’t alter your game plan mid game. You’ll have to keep it going an trust that your guy can get it done. However, once you have seen the guy run the plays in practice that are going to be a part of the game plan you can then get a better idea of what you want to call in what situation. The Broncos didn’t have that in the Redskins game, but they will be able to cultivate a game plan using Simms’ strengths and weaknesses for the Chargers. If they don’t, well that’s on the head coach, not Simms. One of the things that was so great about Belicheck’s teams is that he didn’t force his players into a system, he played to his players strengths and hid their weaknesses. It’s one of the signs of a good head coach.
I know Simms hasn’t played the Chargers, but I’ve got to think that the team does a lot of extra preparation dating back to the offseason for division rivals. Just based off of how divisional games seem to go and the game plans that are put into place there is a tangible difference in those games compared to other games, especially non-conference games. Non-conference games to me seem to end up being less about game-planning for a specific team and more about just running your base offense with an extra play or two you like, whereas the divisional games seem much more meticulously planned. That’s why I’d say that playing the AFC West opponent makes a difference. It may also mean that it helps the run game more than it helps Simms, which in turn keeps Simms’ weaknesses hidden.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
by Wonko on Nov 17, 2009 4:43 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
You may be right.
I’m probably just a little upset over the three straight losses. I’d really like to see Orton get the start because I still think he is the best QB for the job, however you may be right about Simms getting the start on sunday.
Either way, I just hope that McD makes a decision sooner rather than later. Whoever is playing needs to get all the reps this week.
With that said, I think that the Chargers are at an advantage this week. In the last game, the broncos won, courtesy of Eddie Royal and the special teams. I seriously doubt the special teams steps up this week. We are going to have to go toe to toe with the chargers offense and I’m not so sure we can do that with Simms and I don’t know how much the injury will hinder Orton.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 17, 2009 5:17 PM PST up reply actions
Correct me if I'm wrong, but
and please remember I know nothing about what has and will go on at practice in Denver this week.
But with Orton’s ankle suspect right now, I’d expect them to give him as much rest as possible, giving him every opportunity to play on Sunday. Thus, Simms would get all if not most of the reps this week, correct?
Which would make Orton slightly rusty for SD
but would not significantly impact his performance (judging by reps alone, that is). He has an entire offseason and 10 weeks of reps to draw on; one week off in practice won’t affect that.
"I only know as much about myself as my mind can work out under its current conditions. And its current conditions are not good." -- Zaphod Beeblebrox
by Sharpe as a Tack on Nov 18, 2009 11:44 AM PST up reply actions
I think his point
was that Simms would be much more prepared this week, as he would get all the practice time with the first teamers.
by Zach (maestro876) on Nov 18, 2009 12:30 PM PST up reply actions
Even if Orton eventually starts
Simms would be that much better coming off the bench if he had to.
by Zach (maestro876) on Nov 18, 2009 12:30 PM PST up reply actions
Exactly my point
Simms would normally (if Orton was healthy) not be practicing with the A squad, therefore possibly messing up his timing on many routes.
I think the thinking here is to get Orton lots of mental reps and hope he can practice friday and do a walkthrough saturday.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 18, 2009 12:01 PM PST up reply actions
Not to beat this with a stick
But it would seem that (and I know these guys are pros) it would be much more difficult to come off the bench mid-game and be expected to perform than it would if he knew he had a good chance to play all week.
I like Simms, think he’s a decent backup, and is one of those guys who I think could get into a rythmn if prepared.
Don’t get me wrong, I like our chances against either QB.
I couldn't agree more with your last sentence.
I think either QB is going to be at a disadvantage, here. Orton, because he is injured. Simms, because he isn’t very good.
I think that Simms would definitely perform better, given a weeks worth of practice. However, I don’t think his ceiling of potential is very high, either. It would take him weeks to get the hang of this offense against real opponents. Sure, having months of practice reps against the Denver defense is fine, but it still isn’t the same as getting in an actual game.
I think that Simms showed the “deer in the headlights” face when he was back at QB last week. I’m not sure you can shake those happy feet with one week of starters reps in practice.
I’m still unconvinced that Simms is the solution at QB this week.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 18, 2009 4:13 PM PST up reply actions
Look at Chad Henne for a recent example.
His relief work in the Chargers game was horrible, but with weeks of practice has been much improved recently, and not much of a drop off than Noodle Arm.
That's not the same.
Henne has been in that wildcatish offense for two years, now. In Denver, everyone is starting fresh this season. Simms was brought in in the offseason and so was Orton. McDaniels changed everything. Chad Henne has had over a year to play ball and played in 3 games last season, although he wasn’t asked to do much in those starts.
Simms is basically starting off of nothing. It will take him longer, also, because McDaniels is using a system that takes a while to get right.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 18, 2009 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
So basically what you're saying
Is that realistically Simms should be at the level Orton was at in week 1 since they both went through the offseason program, they both missed much of the preseason games, they both practiced with the first unit leading up to the game, they both are guys that McD targetted to play his system and they both had experience starting in the NFL for other teams.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
With the small caveat
That Simms probably isn’t quite as good as Orton from a talent perspective.
I still say that could mean that Simms would be 80-90% (maybe leaning more towards 80%) of a full strength Orton.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
In terms of real game experience, yes.
Again, I’m not sure that his ceiling of talent is as high as Orton’s in this system, though. McD picked Orton over Simms for a reason in the preaseason and I think we saw why last week.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 18, 2009 5:47 PM PST up reply actions
I thought
McD picked Orton over Simms because he was healthiest at the start of the season and played well enough in the first games that there was no reason to consider a replacement. Maybe I’m not recalling my Broncos preseason news updates correctly, but I thought they were neck and neck in the QB competition, but were battling injuries.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
Actually, that's backwards.
Orton was actually injured in the preseason with the finger injury. Simms and Brandstater took over the QB duties for the rest of the preseason and Orton tried to get back in time for the game in Cincinnati.
So, really, McD picked an injured Orton over a healthy Simms. Orton wore a glove, covering a protective piece on his finger, for the first couple games of the regular season.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 19, 2009 5:49 PM PST up reply actions
hmmm
Got this article from nfl.com
Simms said he was still struggling at the Broncos’ first minicamp last summer before finding his rhythm by training camp, then he suffered a high ankle sprain during the preseason.
and then this one from the Rocky Mountain Independent
Adam Schefter at ESPN.com reports that Denver Broncos quarterback Chris Simms, who missed practice Tuesday, could be out two to four weeks with a high ankle sprain. Simms is 16-for-24 passing for 186 yards and two touchdowns in the Broncos’ two preseason games.
Sounds to me like he was hurt when the season started, just as I recalled.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
I forgot about that.
You got me. Simms wasn’t healthy.
That left us with an injured Orton, injured Simms and rookie Tom Brandstater.
McDaniels went with injured Orton.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
by kentuckybronco on Nov 19, 2009 7:25 PM PST up reply actions
It really won't matter too much who is under center
A dinged up Orton is a liability – you can bet that RR will dial up the pass rush if he plays due to his decreased mobility.
Simms has been out of football for quite some time. McDaniels, IMO, didn’t think this through very well when he brought him in as b/u. The 3rd stringer (Branstetter?) might actually be a better option if Orton can’t go.
Regardless of who is under center, I feel pretty confident about this game. I don’t see Rivers losing to the Broncos twice in one season. If the OL holds up OK, we win.
If the thunder don't get ya then the lightning will!!
Robert Hunter
I'm with you.
I don’t like that “we’re going to win” feeling, because there are no guarantees, but I don’t see Denver getting it done. A bomber-type QB can play on an ankle injury, but Orton will have a hard time and will be forced into screen passes and handoffs.
If anything undoes us in this game, the only likely culprit is bad tackling: BMarsh, Royal and Moreno can take advantage of missed tackles, but without that the Donkeys have only their defense, and you can’t trust any defense against the San Diego Globetrotters. Let’s hope the improved Chargers tackling we’ve seen over the last few weeks carries on and becomes the new normal.
by Neoplatonist Bolthead on Nov 18, 2009 10:16 AM PST up reply actions
It's like the conversation I had with my Steelers friend during their game against the Broncos
“You guys can tackle right?”
“Yup.”
“Then the Broncos offense can’t come back.”
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
Probably more concerned about Dawkins
than anyone else on their D. He’s a seasoned vet who can still bring it with the best safeties in the game. I’d look for McDaniels to use him to pressure PR & keep a close eye on LT.
On the offense – watch Marshall, as always. I’m still not that impressed with what Moreno has done.
ST – shut down Royal. He’s as dangerous as they come. I watched him a LOT at Virginia Tech & we all know what he did to us last year & the early game this year.
I like our chances, but we have to play a focused, fundamentally sound ball game. No brain farts, missed assignments/tackles, dropped passes, unfilled lanes. Good sound football wins this one.
If the thunder don't get ya then the lightning will!!
Robert Hunter
McD choked
Plain and simple. Poor coaching execution all around.
Wisdom can not be cultivated through ignorance of information.
by Wonko on Nov 23, 2009 3:48 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
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