Best Young QB after Brady and Manning (P)?

by thad728 on Sep 19, 2008 11:50 AM PDT Comment 19 comments

OK Charger fans. Have a friendly questions from accross the country in Dallas. Im comming over from Bloggin with the Boys with a question about the best "up and comming" young QB in the NFL after Tom and Payton. Want to get your opinions. Scounts Inc put out an article as to who the best young QB was:(in no order) Ben Rothlisburger, Tony Romo, Eli Manning, Phillip Rivers, and Jay Cutler. I think its a great questions to ask and I know your fandom will play into it, but try to look at it through the eyse of someone that has no partiality to anyone on the list.

The question is, who is the best young QB in the league? I guess the best way to look at this, keeping your fandom out of it, is who you would want to start a team of your were to get a new franchise. The arguement that Scounts Inc put out there was Big Ben and Eli have the only hardware. Fair enough. They gave Rivers mad props for palying in the AFC game with the torn ACL last year, which to me doesnt do much bc they lost the game. Cutler, other than two great games this year, hasnt done anything. Their knock on Romo was play in the big games. The only true big game that his QB play wasnt his best was last year agains the GMen. He played well enough to win the Seattle playoff game 2 years ago as a QB. I dont put the drop snap on his "QB" play, but just a crappy fall out. And remember, other than your boy Big Ben, no one does well in their first playoff appearances (aka Payton Manning lost first 6 games)

My thought would be to but Big Ben first, Romo second, Cutler Third and Eli and Rivers fourth and fith (either way). I want to get your opinion as Charger fans on what you would do. I know Eli has a ring, but i do remember last December, everyone in NY was ready to cut off his head and ship him out. I know, as FOOTBALL fans you can admit that your AMAZING DEFENSE won yall that ring (all throughout the playoffs) and Eli just didnt loose you any game. He did step up and make some great plays, but do you think that Eli is truely a GREAT UP AND COMMING QB? Or was he just in the perfect situation, as long as he didnt loose it for you?

I think Tony has what it takes to be good in this league for a long time. As does Big Ben. I really put these two above everyone else. But i must say, if Cutler continues to play like he has started this year, he could be #1 or # 2 next year. I think because i really havent seen enought of Rivers to really comment on. He has some major weapons but just doesnt seem to do much for me. Im open to be convinced otherwise for sure.

Its a tought thought. And i want to try and keep my partiality out of it, but i just see the tangibles and intangibles that Ben and Romo have to be better than Eli as a STAR QB in this league.

Would love your thoughts. Thanks for allowing me to post on your blogg. Good luck!

This FanPost was written by a member of the Bolts From The Blue community and does not necessarily reflect the views of the Bolts From The Blue editors or SB Nation.

0 recs | Comment 19 comments |

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

I gotta throw out Eli

I know he is a SB champ. But he is a mess, his moments are brilliance are canceled out by his moments of stupidity. Despite the playoffs, 2007 was not a good season for him (even in the playoffs). Rivers and Romo are hard to separate from their talent. Romo had the best 2007 season of the lot and the second best 2008 so far. But, Romo is also a over a year and a half older than the second oldest (Rivers). Rivers had a pretty good (much better than Eli) 2007 and his playoff moxie/production adds a little. Cutler is the youngest and least experienced and had the second best 2007 season of the bunch and is having the most productive 2008 season (although it’s party due to how many offensive plays he’s had, Old man Romo and Rivers are better on a per play basis). I’m not a big Ben fan. He’s hurried, sacked and injured more than I’d like and he doesn’t seem to have a full understanding of how to manage the game. However his production beats Rivers’. I still have hope for Jason Campbell (moreso than Eli) as his season was only a little worse than Rivers and I think he’s in a good system now that fits his talents.

BTW, when I comparing/ranking offensive players I’m usually using stats from FootballOutsiders.com because basically any other stats are too context driven.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 19, 2008 12:25 PM PDT reply actions

Um what?

The credibility of your argument went -————————————————→ out the window after reading your title. You don’t “throw out” the SB MVP, who lead arguably the greatest fourth quarter comeback in NFL history against, at that time, an undefeated team. Eli Manning is far and way a better QB than Rivers (who still has to prove to people he can beat top quality competition in the playoffs) and Romo (who he outplayed in the playoffs last year IN Dallas).

Please, leave the anti-Eli bias at the door. Any discussion about great young quarterbacks STARTS with Eli Manning, and anyone who says to throw him out simply doesn’t know WTF they are talking about.

SB Nation's Indianapolis Colts blogger at Stampede Blue. Please make an account and post a diary, add some comments, and make some noise. Accounts are free, and only require an email address.

by BigBlueShoe on Sep 21, 2008 8:24 AM PDT up reply actions

Every one of the

presumably unbiased Scout evaluators put both Eli and Rivers in the 4/5 spots. I’m not saying they’re right, but surely you have to admit there is considerably more doubt about their abilities; certainly statistically Eli is down in the pack. There can be no doubt that SD fans harbor ill will against Eli; but I don’t think you can just throw what we are saying out the window. He played excellent football and stayed within himself during the 2007 playoffs, but would have won absent the stifling defense?

All that said quarterbacking is an art, I doubt there is one right answer here.

"If two hitherto rival football teams, under the influence of brotherly love, decided to co-operate in placing the football first beyond one goal and then beyond the other, no one's happiness would be increased" Bertrand Russell

by Brian (DaBolts) on Sep 21, 2008 10:21 AM PDT up reply actions

Um what?

The credibility of your argument went -————————————————→ out the window after reading “Any discussion about great young quarterbacks STARTS with Eli Manning”. It just shows you are biased and not willing to show any objective analysis. Find someone else to taunt with your baseless rhetoric. You are the weakest link. Goodbye.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 21, 2008 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions

All kidding aside

I actually was a big fan of Eli at Ole Miss and I still like watching some his classic performances (recently saw a good one vs Auburn). I don’t harbor that much ill will towards Eli because I had absolutely zero desire to see the Chargers select a QB this. I’m a Purdue grad and big Drew Brees fan. I still will never truly embrace Rivers because of that. All that is basically irrelevant to any analytical thoughts I have on Eli Manning. The man just doesn’t get it done on a professional level. Sure he rode on the coat tails of a team that won the super bowl while making a couple of good plays along the way. However, the numbers don’t match the hype. The wins don’t even match the hype. The Giants were 1 inch (on a David Akers field goal) from missing the playoffs entirely. It’s hard for me to give a lot of credit to a guy based on what his team did, but in Manning’s case his team was slightly above average and Manning himself is slightly above average. So if you want to evaluate him that way, at least the results are about the same.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 21, 2008 12:18 PM PDT up reply actions

Wrong

(who still has to prove to people he can beat top quality competition in the playoffs)

Did you miss last season’s AFC playoffs?

The ONLY reason, let me repeat, ONLY reason he was SB MVP is because they always give it to the QB. He did everything in his power to lose that game. The run game lead them through the playoffs agaisnt the weaker NFC. The defense did their job in the SB while Sheli was fumbling balls all over the place and got saved by one of the best catches ever. He’s more lucky than good.

People the world over have always been more impressed by the power of our example than by the example of our power.

by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Sep 21, 2008 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions

I have always though that Big Ben is the most overrated QB in the NFL

He has an awesome run game and defense. He only has 12-18 pass attempts per game. For the most part, he doesn’t do anything but hand the ball off good. Well that’s impressive.

Sheli still sucks. He is wildly inconsistant and he did everything in his power to lose the SB. Everyone could tell the Pats were winding down in the playoffs, their offense had dwindled down to almost nothing in the playoffs and they had always had some defensive issues.

Jay Cutler has had two good games against one of the worst teams in football and our defense who obviously haven’t gotten it together. He “fumbled” and threw a pick in the end zone at two crucial moments in last weeks game.

Phil Rivers has been nothing but a winner since starting. Same with Romo.

I would say Romo, Rivers, Ben, Sheli, Cutler

People the world over have always been more impressed by the power of our example than by the example of our power.

by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Sep 19, 2008 1:37 PM PDT reply actions

I think that order looks about right. I think I’d move Roethlisberger to the end of the line, though.

Intentional Blog on Balls

by Richard Wade on Sep 19, 2008 5:22 PM PDT up reply actions

Romo, Cutler, Rivers, Ben, Sheli

But I hate even considering old man Romo.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 19, 2008 8:52 PM PDT up reply actions

And I'd put Campbell ahead of Sheli.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 19, 2008 8:53 PM PDT up reply actions

Cutler in front of Rivers?

People the world over have always been more impressed by the power of our example than by the example of our power.

by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Sep 19, 2008 10:12 PM PDT up reply actions

Like I said

It’s hard to separate Rivers from the talent around him. The Broncos had nothing last year and Cutler was still productive. Cutler is also younger and is producing at or above Rivers’ level.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 20, 2008 8:55 AM PDT up reply actions

Well This Season

Both have 6 TDs and 1 INT (Rivers’ shouldn’t have counted) with Rivers having the higher Passer Rating.

People the world over have always been more impressed by the power of our example than by the example of our power.

by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Sep 20, 2008 10:03 AM PDT up reply actions

I like them both

Cutler did just have a couple flat out drops and one int near our endzone. It’s probably too early to call, but he seems just a little more jumpy under pressure.

by Brian (DaBolts) on Sep 20, 2008 11:15 AM PDT up reply actions

Agreed.

People the world over have always been more impressed by the power of our example than by the example of our power.

by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Sep 20, 2008 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions

Forget passer rating

It has very little mathematical correlation with winning. Use DYAR (total value for the entire year) and DVOA (value per play). So far this year Cutler has more DYAR than anyone, but Rivers has more DVOA. Those are the only stats that matter. If you count TDs and INTs, then you are hurting anyone that throws a bunch of good passes to get to the goal line and gets robbed by a 1 yd RB run and you also count meaningless INTs that come when you are far behind and forced to pass. Value comes from getting 40% of yards to on first down, 65% of yards on 2nd down and 100% of yards on 3rd and 4th down. Also, converted third down and getting production while in the parts of the field close to either end zone (back zone or red zone). Those all correlate the best with winning and make up DYAR and DVOA.

Homer: Ohhhh, The Denver Broncos.
Marge: Whats wrong with the Denver Broncos?
Homer: Marge you just don't understand football.

by Wonko on Sep 20, 2008 11:43 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs